Super Saturday, Game 1: Italy v Wales

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ITALY v WALES
Saturday 21 March 2015
KO: 13:30 (local)/12:30 (UK/Ireland)
Stadio Olimpico, Rome

Referee: Chris Pollock (NZR)
AR1: JP Doyle (RFU)
AR2: Luke Pearce (RFU)
TMO: Simon McDowell (IRFU)

***********************

A. Teams

ITALY

Luke McClean (Sale Sharks); Leonardo Sarto (Zebre Rugby), Luca Morisi (Benetton Treviso), Andrea Masi (London Wasps), Giovambattista Venditti (Zebre Rugby); Kelly Haimona (Zebre Rugby), Edoardo Gori (Benetton Treviso); 1 Michele Rizzo (Leicester Tigers), Leonardo Ghiraldini (Leicester Tigers, capt), Martin Castrogiovanni (RT Toulon), George Biagi (Zebre Rugby), Joshua Furno (Newcastle Falcons), Francesco Minto (Benetton Treviso), Mauro Bergamasco (Zebre Rugby), Samuela VUNISA (Zebre Rugby)

Replacements: Andrea Manici (Zebre Rugby), Alberto De Marchi (Sale Sharks), Dario Chistolini (Zebre Rugby), Quintin Geldenhuys (Zebre Rugby), Robert Barbieri (Leicester Tigers), Guglielmo Palazzini (Zebre Rugby), Luciano Orquera (Zebre Rugby), Enrico Bacchin (Benetton Treviso).

WALES

Leigh Halfpenny (Toulon); George North (Northampton Saints), Jonathan Davies (ASM Clermont Auvergne), Jamie Roberts (Racing Metro), Liam Williams (Scarlets); Dan Biggar (Ospreys), Rhys Webb (Ospreys); Rob Evans (Scarlets), Scott Baldwin (Ospreys), Aaron Jarvis (Ospreys), Luke Charteris (Racing Metro), Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys), Dan Lydiate (Ospreys), Sam Warburton (Cardiff Blues, capt), Taulupe Faletau (Newport Gwent Dragons).

Replacements: Ken Owens (Scarlets), Rhys Gill (Saracens), Scott Andrews (Cardiff Blues), Jake Ball (Scarlets), Justin Tipuric (Ospreys), Gareth Davies (Scarlets), Rhys Priestland (Scarlets), Scott Williams (Scarlets).

B. Head to Head

15 Played 15

2 Wins 12

12 Losses 2

1 Draws 1

19 Tries 49

12 Conversions 40

31 Penalties 45

4 Drop Goals 1

224 Points 463

Slightly off topic here. any news on Leigh Halfpenny?

Looked like a bone break or fracture than an actual concussion? Terrible hit. Why does he insist on putting his head in the wrong place though? He has the courage of a Lion, really admire his passion and drive, which is an aspect totally distinct from the aspect he usually gets all his credit for - the kicking.
But he does put his body on the line in dramatic terms quite often.
Hope he's ok.

SecretFly wrote:Looked like a bone break or fracture than an actual concussion?  Terrible hit.  Why does he insist on putting his head in the wrong place though?  He has the courage of a Lion, really admire his passion and drive, which is an aspect totally distinct from the aspect he usually gets all his credit for - the kicking.
But he does put his body on the line in dramatic terms quite often.  
Hope he's ok.

Almost every player does it nowadays.. Sean O'Brien did it in the Ireland game, looked painful. I'm surprised it wasn't mentioned!

Once Orquerra tried to chip the Welsh defence only for them to field the kick and run in under the posts almost unopposed Italy looked like a broken team and gave up. Surely the Italy performance yesterday and against France raises huge question marks over their ability to compete in this tournament. Coupled with the fact that their two Celtic league teams fail to compete year after year must be an embarrassment to their nation and to the 6Ns tournament. The 6Ns organisers should think about giving Italy a couple of years break from the humiliation they take year after year until they are ready to compete properly again. At the moment they are just everyone's whipping boys. Even the dire Scotland team should have beaten them.

Griff wrote:2 on 1, odds on you're going to lose out. Stop blaming the last man left with 2 men to defend. Blame the team.

The tournament was lost by taking our foot off the gas in the first game. We should have been winning a fifth championship with a fourth Grand Slam in a decade yesterday.

A great six nations championship and Wales did well bar the forty minutes of the second half vs england where we completely imploded.


By the third game we the form team by the end we look like we are contenders for great things. An ominous six nations but one where we have improved in many areas.

maestegmafia wrote:
The tournament was lost by taking our foot off the gas in the first game. We should have been winning a fifth championship with a fourth Grand Slam in a decade yesterday.

I keep seeing posts like this. Maybe, just maybe England came out after half time and played well? ah no, silly me it was because Wales stopped playing.

Yeah, Maesteg, but Ireland could say they didn't have enough foot on the gas in the first 40 of their away game to Wales.  Lost the Slam because of it.  AWAY
And England could say they didn't give Ireland enough of a game in the first 40 in Dublin.  Lost the Slam because of it. AWAY

How come it's only Wales who are the team that were the only true contenders for the Slam ...had one HOME game gone more their way???

we all deserved to win. but ireland deserved it more- because we all knew the rules..

its great to have 3 top performing Lions based teams..

Role on the RWC.

Maest in being Maest

maestegmafia wrote:

Griff wrote:2 on 1, odds on you're going to lose out. Stop blaming the last man left with 2 men to defend. Blame the team.

The tournament was lost by taking our foot off the gas in the first game. We should have been winning a fifth championship with a fourth Grand Slam in a decade yesterday.

A great six nations championship and Wales did well bar the forty minutes of the second half vs england where we completely imploded.


By the third game we the form team by the end we look like we are contenders for great things. An ominous six nations but one where we have improved in many areas.

Ifs, buts and maybes. They didn't as they came third even with Italy imploding in the 2nd half.

LondonTiger wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:
The tournament was lost by taking our foot off the gas in the first game. We should have been winning a fifth championship with a fourth Grand Slam in a decade yesterday.

I keep seeing posts like this. Maybe, just maybe England came out after half time and played well? ah no, silly me it was because Wales stopped playing.

Considering Wales played at a higher level in all but the forty minutes in question, You have to agree that Wales took their foot off the gas and cost themselves a grandslam.

Something that they seem to have learnt from well as their hve been consistent improvements since that second half in Cardiff.

Thought Biggar actually did a really good effort and nearly stopped a, what should have been certain, try.

SecretFly wrote:Yeah, Maesteg, but Ireland could say they didn't have enough foot on the gas in the first 40 of their away game to Wales.  Lost the Slam because of it.  AWAY
And England could say they didn't give Ireland enough of a game in the first 40 in Dublin.  Lost the Slam because of it. AWAY

How come it's only Wales who are the team that were the only true contenders for the Slam ...had one HOME game gone more their way???

mmyou could say that fly mate but we out layed you in that first forty... Even whilst losing first choice key players.


The 2nd half vs england we made tactical errors, shortening line outs being a big one.

And England out played Wales in the 2nd half.

maestegmafia wrote:

SecretFly wrote:Yeah, Maesteg, but Ireland could say they didn't have enough foot on the gas in the first 40 of their away game to Wales.  Lost the Slam because of it.  AWAY
And England could say they didn't give Ireland enough of a game in the first 40 in Dublin.  Lost the Slam because of it. AWAY

How come it's only Wales who are the team that were the only true contenders for the Slam ...had one HOME game gone more their way???

mmyou could say that fly mate but we out layed you in that first forty... Even whilst losing first choice key players.


The 2nd half vs england we made tactical errors, shortening line outs being a big one.

God.....

...well away you go with that fantasy then. The patting each other on the back period didn't last long

Had Ireland played with even a degree of the bite they played in Scotland, they'd have the Slam instead of the Title.

BamBam wrote:

Steve_rugby wrote:

TheRugbyMaster wrote:Incredible stuff from the six nations champions!

Who ?

Oops, sorry Ghostie

(Not aimed at any real Welsh fans)

Too easy to get a bite or two there.

Steve_rugby wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

Griff wrote:2 on 1, odds on you're going to lose out. Stop blaming the last man left with 2 men to defend. Blame the team.

The tournament was lost by taking our foot off the gas in the first game. We should have been winning a fifth championship with a fourth Grand Slam in a decade yesterday.

A great six nations championship and Wales did well bar the forty minutes of the second half vs england where we completely imploded.


By the third game we the form team by the end we look like we are contenders for great things. An ominous six nations but one where we have improved in many areas.

Ifs, buts and maybes. They didn't as they came third even with Italy imploding in the 2nd half.

As I remember, you were full of ifs and buts after the first round of rugby, so a bit rich coming from you. I can't agree with MMs post though. We should not have been winning and did not win our fifth championship because the team was nowhere near good enough. Our form has been terrible. We might have improved in some areas such as the lineout, but our defence has taken a backwards step as we conceded more than two tries...

SecretFly wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

SecretFly wrote:Yeah, Maesteg, but Ireland could say they didn't have enough foot on the gas in the first 40 of their away game to Wales.  Lost the Slam because of it.  AWAY
And England could say they didn't give Ireland enough of a game in the first 40 in Dublin.  Lost the Slam because of it. AWAY

How come it's only Wales who are the team that were the only true contenders for the Slam ...had one HOME game gone more their way???

mmyou could say that fly mate but we out layed you in that first forty... Even whilst losing first choice key players.


The 2nd half vs england we made tactical errors, shortening line outs being a big one.

God.....

...well away you go with that fantasy then.  The patting each other on the back period didn't last long

Had Ireland played with even a degree of the bite they played in Scotland, they'd have the Slam instead of the Title.  

Hahaha yeah right, fact was a better team played you and beat you in Cardiff. 16000+ posts try and get something right.

Believe that myth if you must rainbow

...and I'll try really hard to believe maesteg's assertion that it wasn't England that came back at Wales like a train but only themselves 'turning off the gas'. How bloody negligent of the Welsh to turn off the gas and still explode. The gas inspectors will be most displeased.

SecretFly wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

SecretFly wrote:Yeah, Maesteg, but Ireland could say they didn't have enough foot on the gas in the first 40 of their away game to Wales.  Lost the Slam because of it.  AWAY
And England could say they didn't give Ireland enough of a game in the first 40 in Dublin.  Lost the Slam because of it. AWAY

How come it's only Wales who are the team that were the only true contenders for the Slam ...had one HOME game gone more their way???

mmyou could say that fly mate but we out layed you in that first forty... Even whilst losing first choice key players.


The 2nd half vs england we made tactical errors, shortening line outs being a big one.

God.....

...well away you go with that fantasy then.  The patting each other on the back period didn't last long

Had Ireland played with even a degree of the bite they played in Scotland, they'd have the Slam instead of the Title.  

Thats the point isn't it, they didnt have any bite v Wales, it was more like the toothless gumming of a decrepit old spinster.

Gwlad wrote:

Thats the point isn't it, they didnt have any bite v Wales, it was more like the toothless gumming of a decrepit old spinster.

There you go.  The old, creaking, kicking, saggy-pants farmers from the Westh - took a title by playing no rugby and scoring zilch tries.  Ah, you don't believe how sweet that sounds Gwlad.  Of all three sides that fought out yesterday in that Classic day, nobody would deny Ireland has most scope for improving.  They've been rusty and unconvincing though the whole thing - and yet............................

Gwlad wrote:

Thats the point isn't it, they didnt have any bite v Wales, it was more like the toothless gumming of a decrepit old spinster.

I didn't realise you were female.

Steve_rugby wrote:

Gwlad wrote:

Thats the point isn't it, they didnt have any bite v Wales, it was more like the toothless gumming of a decrepit old spinster.

I didn't realise you were female.

I have no doubt you wouldn't recognize a female if she lifted her skirts in front of you steve, something i expect happens rarely.

Gwlad wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

SecretFly wrote:Yeah, Maesteg, but Ireland could say they didn't have enough foot on the gas in the first 40 of their away game to Wales.  Lost the Slam because of it.  AWAY
And England could say they didn't give Ireland enough of a game in the first 40 in Dublin.  Lost the Slam because of it. AWAY

How come it's only Wales who are the team that were the only true contenders for the Slam ...had one HOME game gone more their way???

mmyou could say that fly mate but we out layed you in that first forty... Even whilst losing first choice key players.


The 2nd half vs england we made tactical errors, shortening line outs being a big one.

God.....

...well away you go with that fantasy then.  The patting each other on the back period didn't last long

Had Ireland played with even a degree of the bite they played in Scotland, they'd have the Slam instead of the Title.  

Thats the point isn't it, they didnt have any bite v Wales, it was more like the toothless gumming of a decrepit old spinster.

Exactly...!

If Ireland replayed Wales next week the result would be the same, Wales would win convincingly again.

Maes, not sure how you can say that unless it's a bit tongue in cheek or you're having a bit of 'WUM-fun'?!

If we played next week at home then I still think it would be too close to call. You say 'win convincingly again' but we didn't win convincingly the first time! It could quite easily have been a drawn game at the end. 'Convincingly' would suggest to me out of sight and no chance of it not being a win at the end, but we know that was not the case.

Griff wrote:Maes, not sure how you can say that unless it's a bit tongue in cheek or you're having a bit of 'WUM-fun'?!

If we played next week at home then I still think it would be too close to call. You say 'win convincingly again' but we didn't win convincingly the first time! It could quite easily have been a drawn game at the end. 'Convincingly' would suggest to me out of sight and no chance of it not being a win at the end, but we know that was not the case.

Griff with all due respect to you and Fly, I dissagree. No matter what Ireland threw at us they didn't have enough.

I thought we outplayed them tactically, defensively and skilfully at the lineouts, the breakdown and in attack, where we took our opportunities and they couldn't creat any no matter how many phases of possession they had.

They had us at scrum time but we lost our two first choice props to injury. Our reserves were both third choice players.

Something for Wales to be very proud of because Ireland are a very good team.

Not saying I'm not proud of it. I thought we were awesome. I just don't think it was a convincing win. Maybe we see the word 'convincing' in a different way. Convincing to me means beyond doubt. But it was very close at the end. Ireland could have tied the game. Therefore not a convincing win. More a narrow win. And not sure why that means we'd definitely win next week if we played.

Yesterday v Italy was a convincing win though! D

The two pre-RWC games against Ireland will be interesting. And they aren't that far away either.

I just worry that these games are a bit too 'tough' ahead of a big tournament. I know we want to hit the ground running in the tournament but I fear we (and Ireland) could lose a few players to injury. That would be a huge shame.

Griff wrote:I just worry that these games are a bit too 'tough' ahead of a big tournament. I know we want to hit the ground running in the tournament but I fear we (and Ireland) could lose a few players to injury. That would be a huge shame.

Risk of injury in any game though Griff.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Griff wrote:I just worry that these games are a bit too 'tough' ahead of a big tournament. I know we want to hit the ground running in the tournament but I fear we (and Ireland) could lose a few players to injury. That would be a huge shame.

Risk of injury in any game though Griff.

Obvs. But there's bad blood between these two teams now. These games could be a bloodbath.

Griff wrote:

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Griff wrote:I just worry that these games are a bit too 'tough' ahead of a big tournament. I know we want to hit the ground running in the tournament but I fear we (and Ireland) could lose a few players to injury. That would be a huge shame.

Risk of injury in any game though Griff.

Obvs. But there's bad blood between these two teams now. These games could be a bloodbath.

Excellent preparation for a RWC campaign then. Bring it on!

Minus a few very important players. You mark my words.

maestegmafia wrote:
If Ireland replayed Wales next week the result would be the same, Wales would win convincingly again.

Convincingly ? Really ? Do you really believe the garbage you type? Mind you, If England played Wales again next week, the result would be an even bigger convincing win for England.

Steve_rugby wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:
If Ireland replayed Wales next week the result would be the same, Wales would win convincingly again.

Convincingly ? Really ? Do you really believe the garbage you type? Mind you, If England played Wales again next week, the result would be an even bigger convincing win for England.

I seriously doubt that England would beat Wales if they re-played.

we will find out in september. no reason to doubt, seriously or otherwise. just wait 6 months and we will know with certainty.

Steve_rugby wrote:If England played Wales again next week, the result would be an even bigger convincing win for England

And on what do you actually base this on then? You caught us cold when we hadn't hit form. Kudos to you for doing it and we only have ourselves to blame but now we have found form (the kind of form that beats Ireland) what makes you think England would win by more?

A good WUM I'm guessing though

Steve_rugby wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:
If Ireland replayed Wales next week the result would be the same, Wales would win convincingly again.

Convincingly ? Really ? Do you really believe the garbage you type? Mind you, If England played Wales again next week, the result would be an even bigger convincing win for England.

In the interest of balance and fairness, and as I slated Maesteg's comments, how on earth can you say that? It was a 5 point game (Wal v Eng). Yes, England were much better than Wales in the second half. But not that much better where it counts: on the scoreboard. And no guarantee either that it would happen again next week. Wales have clearly got better as the tournament has progressed and England have maintained the same level. Too close to call.

maestegmafia wrote:

I seriously doubt that england would beat Wales if they re-played.

I don't. They would convincingly beat Wales again. They just didn't turn up for the first 40 minutes, once they did, they convincingly beat Wales.

Griff, I wouldn't be surprised if we don't see too many important players in the friendlies, more like Tips instead of Warburton, Cawdor instead of Webb, Anscomme instead of Biggar, and Sanjay instead of Halfpenny.  Then have a few players who will be trying to sneak into the RWC squad (Navidi/Cubby, Ll Williams/Philips, Priest/Hook/Patch) on the bench.

Steffan wrote:
And on what do you actually base this on then? You caught us cold when we hadn't hit form. Kudos to you for doing it and we only have ourselves to blame but now we have found form (the kind of form that beats Ireland) what makes you think England would win by more?

On the same basis that he says Wales would convincingly beat Ireland again. Wales had hit form in the first half and then England hit their form in the second half.

maestegmafia wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:
The tournament was lost by taking our foot off the gas in the first game. We should have been winning a fifth championship with a fourth Grand Slam in a decade yesterday.

I keep seeing posts like this. Maybe, just maybe England came out after half time and played well? ah no, silly me it was because Wales stopped playing.

Considering Wales played at a higher level in all but the forty minutes in question, You have to agree that Wales took their foot off the gas and cost themselves a grandslam.

Something that they seem to have learnt from well as their hve been consistent improvements since that second half in Cardiff.

I thought England bossed this game for the 80 minutes. Apart from an opportunistic try early on we were hanging in there all game. I was actaully dreading the 2nd half as the writing was on the wall. For me this has more to do with many key players playing little rugby, note John Davies, Warburton, Roberts and others, they have had little continuous intensity for 2-3 months. We were undercooked and well off the pace. England were far superior on the day in every department IMO.

I was very impressed with both Wales and England. They're both class in my opinion. I wish I had the confidence that Welsh fans frequently display when they've played a couple of good games. I'm always riddled with doubts and terribly nervous about Ireland.

Griff wrote:Minus a few very important players. You mark my words.

That's good though isn't it since it will help bring the benchers up to speed. We'll need them I reckon considering we have England an Oz in our group who have been there, done it, got the t-shirt, etc.

FecklessRogue wrote:I was very impressed with both Wales and England. They're both class in my opinion. I wish I had the confidence that Welsh fans frequently display when they've played a couple of good games. I'm always riddled with doubts and terribly nervous about Ireland.

Don't be fooled by our outward expression of optimism Feckless. We tremble like Feck underneath that false facade and having Priestland on the bench doesn't help those feelings!!!!!!!

Steve_rugby wrote:

Steffan wrote:
And on what do you actually base this on then? You caught us cold when we hadn't hit form. Kudos to you for doing it and we only have ourselves to blame but now we have found form (the kind of form that beats Ireland) what makes you think England would win by more?

On the same basis that he says Wales would convincingly beat Ireland again. Wales had hit form in the first half and then England hit their form in the second half.

Wales didn't convincingly beat Ireland. Could've gone either way. Best game of the tournament.

understandably from your perspective

england france best game for me

best game in the last 10 years in NH rugby

quinsforever wrote:understandably from your perspective

england france best game for me

best game in the last 10 years in NH rugby

Indeed, a fantastic game of rugby.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

Griff wrote:Minus a few very important players. You mark my words.

That's good though isn't it since it will help bring the benchers up to speed. We'll need them I reckon considering we have England an Oz in our group who have been there, done it, got the t-shirt, etc.

You misunderstand me. I mean we'll be minus some important players for the whole world cup beacuse we'll lose a few to injury during the pre-world cup Ireland bloodbath. So the benchers will be first choice and then we'll have some right old so and so's on the bench

England v France was a great game to watch.  As someone alluded to somewhere - it was like a 7s game.  And of course, many people besides English and French people had a firm heart in it (or perhaps feeble hearts by the end!)
Yet I don't want to disrespect France but I think everyone knew who was going to win that game - the only big question mark was by how much.
Had England not needed to chase, France wouldn't have had 35 points and England might have settled for the same number.

Strange Day!  Best Six Nations day in its history for the intrigue, bravado rugby and that building, building unbearable tension through all three games.  Already becoming legendary and only one day old.

quinsforever wrote:understandably from your perspective

england france best game for me

best game in the last 10 years in NH rugby

England v France was great, but it was all about how many rather than just winning. Wales v Ireland was different. Yesterday was a bit mad. Enjoyable and I hope it happens again, but still mad.