Pacquaio vs. Marquez: SPOILERS!!! How do YOU feel?

First topic message reminder :

Am I seeing the same thing here? Marquez is SCHOOLING Pacquiao?

It's Round 8 and I've got Marquez 5 rounds up...

I just feel for Marquez so much because he felt robbed over the first two but this time his performance was just as good but he didn't suffer the knockdowns. How Arum and Pacquiao can sleep tonight I don't know. Oh yeah, that's how-on mattresses stuffed with hundred-dollar bills.

Yeah. Utter - Utter puke.

Round one Pac 10-9
Two Pac 10-9 (but could be 10-10)
Three Marq 10-9
Four Pac 10-9
Five Marq 10-9 (easiest round to score so far)
Six 10-10
Seven Pac 10-9 (Maybe 10-10?)
Eight Marq 10-9
Nine 10-10
Ten Marq 10-9
Eleven 10-10
Twelve Pac 10-9

So Pacquiao by a round.

That's how I scored it, Interesingly if I score seven and two as draws then the result flips to a Marquez victory.

According to The Guardian:

Maybe Marquez is hacked off: he appears to have left the ring before he can be interviewed. And he's pulled the plug on his way out of the room, so they can't interview Pacman either...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/nov/13/manny-pacquaio-juan-manuel-marquez-live

I don't blame him.

They had it 116-114 JMM.

Fox had it 118-110 Marquez. http://msn.foxsports.com/boxing/story/Manny-Pacquiao-Juan-Manuel-Marquez-Round-by-round-111211

i know 2 things. 1 JMM is a legend that surpassed everyones expectations (i thought he was more effective tonight and i am a guy who said PAC KO 6 before hand)and 2 Mayweather would counter pacs head off if they fought

Boxers should boycott Top Rank.

[quote="TechInept"]Round one Pac 10-9
Two Pac 10-9 (but could be 10-10)
Three Marq 10-9
Four Pac 10-9
Five Marq 10-9 (easiest round to score so far)
Six 10-10
Seven Pac 10-9 (Maybe 10-10?)
Eight Marq 10-9
Nine 10-10
Ten Marq 10-9
Eleven 10-10
Twelve Pac 10-9

So Pacquiao by a round.

you would never get so many drawn rounds in a championship fight. also funny how marquez best rounds are drawn and mannys best rounds are won. round 2 was marquez round by a mile, i was quite shocked when amir khan went out of his way to say so

14/1 marquez on points...i had a bit riding on it, but even after the 12th i knew they would rob him. after marquez excellent performance i just hope he does one more thing..turn down a rematch, you dont need the money, let these crooks play by themselves

This was absolutely scandalous, feel so sorry for Marquez he put up a masterclass in counter punching. I had Marquez 3 rounds up and I hope some kind of justice is done.

PPVxHOTTY wrote:This was absolutely scandalous, feel so sorry for Marquez he put up a masterclass in counter punching. I had Marquez 3 rounds up and I hope some kind of justice is done.

It won't be. Arum and Team Pacquiao will avoid Mayweather and he'll retire to go into politics. Maybe with a couple fights against stiffs to pad his wallet.

BALTIMORA wrote:

PPVxHOTTY wrote:This was absolutely scandalous, feel so sorry for Marquez he put up a masterclass in counter punching. I had Marquez 3 rounds up and I hope some kind of justice is done.

It won't be. Arum and Team Pacquiao will avoid Mayweather and he'll retire to go into politics. Maybe with a couple fights against stiffs to pad his wallet.

I agree. They only fought Marquez because they thought he was done.

https://2img.net/h/oi43.tinypic.com/2iiiv4k.jpg


Baltimora you're right as he is Top Ranks cashcow they needed this result. Check the above link in fact everyone this is the so called scorecard, absolute joke.

That 116-112...what a joke. You're dead right they only fought Marquez because they thought he was done. He bust Pacquiao's face up more than any of his last half dozen opponents have done, out-boxed him and comes away with a robbery and presumably a sore ass.

My personal opinion is that Arum 'persuaded' the judges to favour a big-money Mayweather fight. Vegas politics. Marquez wins (officially) and no-one wants to see him fight Mayweather again. Likewise interest in a Mayweather-Pacquiao fight would be less, as would Pacquiao's ability to demand a 50-50 split.

PPVxHOTTY wrote:https://2img.net/h/oi43.tinypic.com/2iiiv4k.jpg


Baltimora you're right as he is Top Ranks cashcow they needed this result. Check the above link in fact everyone this is the so called scorecard, absolute joke.

Hang on...that card says 'WBO Jr Welterweight' in the top left corner. Does that invalidate the result...

Everyone else watching it with me thought it was a Marquez win too! I might have been judging 'through the eyes' of the other judges though, as in, I thought they would be pro Paquiao.

Hope this settles the debate about who's favourite in the potential Mayweather fight now.

Pacquiao hasn't looked brilliant for awhile now, is he fading?

I think he might be fading a touch but I also think the more decisive factor was Marquez's style. You may have heard Khan mention that 'styles make fights' once or twice during the fight...

Very depressing, makes you think sport is dead.

Everyone wants Manny to win so he can fight Mayweather and lots of people can makes lots of money - pathetic.

Ringside punch stats showed just how close the fight was. Pacquiao was credited with landing 176 of 578 punches, while Marquez landed 138 of 436.

According to:

http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2011/nov/12/box-pacquiao-marquez-2nd-ld-writethru/

Baltimora Jr Welterweight limit is 136-140, welterweight limit is 141-147...so this was a catchweight of 144, which would mean it was welter not jr welter lol you have a point. These catchweights are destroying the sport of boxing, especially when their is a belt on the line. I mean come on if you fight surely you should be aloud to fight at the 'upper' or 'lower' limit. Meeting inbetween etc is just Uncle Bobs way of of cashing in on paydays.

I posed this point to many people, and til today have not had a reasonable 'unbiased' response, when Manny fought Cotto it was at catchweight of 145, even if Cotto was aloud to reach 'upper' limit of 147, I and many others believe Manny would still have won the fight. But why was it imposed?. My opinion is Roach and rest of team Pac are only fighting guys who are either shot or washed up goods. This is the harsh reality and slowly everything is being exposed.

Manny stopped taking the drugs!! Ever since he was accused he got scared and layed of them. JMM exposed him PBF would counter all night and have fun

I didn't mind the catchweight in this as much as in the Cotto & Margarito fights because in those it was more clearly put in place to give Pacquiao an advantage. In this both guys were small fighters. I'd have rather seen it at 140 or even lightweight, but after the result I think one thing is clear: Marquez would always have had Pacquiao's number (so long as he wasn't knocked down) but would never be given a decision.

Marquez hints at retiring:

http://sports.yahoo.com/box/news?slug=ro-rogers_marquez_pacquiao_controversy_rematch_111211

Im not sure I agree on the weight. If anything Marquez looked the best of the three fights at the highest weight. I think it ended up suited him more. We have to remember that Marquez is getting older and it becomes harder and harder to make the lower weights. The added weight seemed to help him as he bulked up effectively. I expected Pacquiao to win this but not as easily as most predicted and I didnt buy into thw argument that Manny outsized Marquez significantly. I based Pacquiao being favourite on Marquez being older.

Stylewise hes always been hard for Pacquiao to unlock but I dont think the first two fights were robberies of any sort. They could have gone either way so I think theres a danger of history being rewritten as Pacquiao robbed Marquez all three times. This last fight was the clearest of the three encounters though and theres no doubt in my mind Marquez won.

I wasn't convinced that Pacquiao out-sized Marquez, although I admit I was vocal about my dislike for the fight at welter, but I did think the fight was being held at the higher weight because Pacquiao's team felt it would benefit them more, given his longer run at welterweight. I think now that Pacquiao and his team will either put too many obstacles in the way of a Mayweather fight and try to blame Mayweather, or he'll just cash out with a mega payday but a fourth (official) loss on his record.

Mayweather must be laughing after the fight tonight.

BALTIMORA wrote:I wasn't convinced that Pacquiao out-sized Marquez, although I admit I was vocal about my dislike for the fight at welter, but I did think the fight was being held at the higher weight because Pacquiao's team felt it would benefit them more, given his longer run at welterweight. I think now that Pacquiao and his team will either put too many obstacles in the way of a Mayweather fight and try to blame Mayweather, or he'll just cash out with a mega payday but a fourth (official) loss on his record.

Mayweather must be laughing after the fight tonight.

Don't think so mate - I reckon he was drawing it out a little to get a little more money and legacy. I think he will still make the money but that Legacy takes a hit. I said before that Mayweather Pacman would be like Mosley - Margarito and I this just reinforces my view, I know there are some differences between JMM + PBF but no one counters like Mayweather and no one has his sublime timing.

Even though Pacquaio got the decision, this fight will now put a dent in the Mayweather/Pacquiao fight because what looked like a 50/50 fight now suddenly looks alot less competitive. The will be viewed as an unofficial loss for Pacquiao which isnt really what you want either commercially or professionally going into the biggest fight of this millenium. In some ways it serves them right for overcooking the fight so long and if Mayweather suddenly comes out and demands the fight then hes going to lose just as much credibility for timing it when Pacquiao looks vunerable. The fight should have happened in the last two years but its losing significance with every passing month and this latest robbery has dealt it a blow.

That's why I said one of two things. Neither would surprise me but you're right; after the building-up of a Pac-May fight they have to do it. Besides, Arum has to recoup some of that money he's spent on judges.

manos de piedra wrote:Even though Pacquaio got the decision, this fight will now put a dent in the Mayweather/Pacquiao fight because what looked like a 50/50 fight now suddenly looks alot less competitive. The will be viewed as an unofficial loss for Pacquiao which isnt really what you want either commercially or professionally going into the biggest fight of this millenium. In some ways it serves them right for overcooking the fight so long and if Mayweather suddenly comes out and demands the fight then hes going to lose just as much credibility for timing it when Pacquiao looks vunerable. The fight should have happened in the last two years but its losing significance with every passing month and this latest robbery has dealt it a blow.

Re overcooking: same thing happened with Juanma-Gambo. Arum and his greed once more killing boxing.

Big shocker:

http://philboxing.com/news/story-62725.html

They had it 115-113 for Pacquiao...

BALTIMORA wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:Even though Pacquaio got the decision, this fight will now put a dent in the Mayweather/Pacquiao fight because what looked like a 50/50 fight now suddenly looks alot less competitive. The will be viewed as an unofficial loss for Pacquiao which isnt really what you want either commercially or professionally going into the biggest fight of this millenium. In some ways it serves them right for overcooking the fight so long and if Mayweather suddenly comes out and demands the fight then hes going to lose just as much credibility for timing it when Pacquiao looks vunerable. The fight should have happened in the last two years but its losing significance with every passing month and this latest robbery has dealt it a blow.

Re overcooking: same thing happened with Juanma-Gambo. Arum and his greed once more killing boxing.

Possibly, although I dont think the blame rests squarely with Arum for this one. Ive never been convinced Mayweather wanted this fight particularly either and dont think hes pushed that hard for it. I think Pacquaio has tended to get a rougher time in the blame game because hes perceived to take easier options than Mayweather. I think its only marginally true though and Mayweather tends to sit on the sideline until a juicy lower risk fight comes along for himself. Ortiz and Mosely were credible opponents at the time but in all reality not really that live or any better than Marquez or Margarito for example.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH!

I want to punch Arum in the face and a couple of them judges too!

manos de piedra wrote:

BALTIMORA wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:Even though Pacquaio got the decision, this fight will now put a dent in the Mayweather/Pacquiao fight because what looked like a 50/50 fight now suddenly looks alot less competitive. The will be viewed as an unofficial loss for Pacquiao which isnt really what you want either commercially or professionally going into the biggest fight of this millenium. In some ways it serves them right for overcooking the fight so long and if Mayweather suddenly comes out and demands the fight then hes going to lose just as much credibility for timing it when Pacquiao looks vunerable. The fight should have happened in the last two years but its losing significance with every passing month and this latest robbery has dealt it a blow.

Re overcooking: same thing happened with Juanma-Gambo. Arum and his greed once more killing boxing.

Possibly, although I dont think the blame rests squarely with Arum for this one. Ive never been convinced Mayweather wanted this fight particularly either and dont think hes pushed that hard for it. I think Pacquaio has tended to get a rougher time in the blame game because hes perceived to take easier options than Mayweather. I think its only marginally true though and Mayweather tends to sit on the sideline until a juicy lower risk fight comes along for himself. Ortiz and Mosely were credible opponents at the time but in all reality not really that live or any better than Marquez or Margarito for example.

Fair point although, I reckon Manny should have called their bluff and said I will take the test loud and clear. Mayweather overcooks alot of fights - he should stop trying to milk every single penny out of the fans and get on with it.

Manos I agree entirely that Mayweather has to shoulder at least a portion of the blame for the fight not having happened already. I think my dislike (mildly putting it) of Arum comes from the fact that while Mayweather is making one fight difficult to organise, Arum has his fingers in many pies.

Arum is despicable.

Too right. As I've just read from someone on another forum: why is he saying there should be a fourth fight if he thinks Pacquiao won?

Just read this on 'another' 606 forum (NOT 606):

D4thincarnation
I had Marquez winning by 115-113, but I was being generous to Pacquiao.

116-112 maybe more likely.

Will watch it again.

Think Marquez got robbed this time.

http://www.not606.com/showthread.php/100667-Pacquiao-vs-Marquez-In-a-singing-contest.?p=1673988#post1673988



Someone call Hell, their boiler must be on the blink.

Short of Pacquaio coming clean and saying he lost, D4 saying he lost is probably the next best endorsement for Marquez

I...I'm speechless. Almost. Punch stats favour Pacquiao, but I think it may be the case that he did a lot of work in fewer rounds.

Bad night for boxing. Thought the Fury fight was stopped ridiculously early.

Is there currently any sport in the world where the judging, refereeing is so poor?

I don't think so. I thought the Fury stoppage was a bit early. They were too scrappy and his opponent was being leant on and mauled rather than beat up.

I was gutted that I missed the fight because of family reasons, Marquez is my favorite fighter and I had faith that he could show some people how good he is. Pacquiao has fought the same type of fighter since the last marquez fight. People who thought they were bigger than him and could walk right through him. Marquez is a smart fighter and pacquaio can't deal with that, could you imagine what mayweather would have done?

Everyone wrote him off, I didn't and although I lose prediction points i'm really glad my faith in him was justified. I haven't seen the fight yet but I can't wait to get home and watch it!

Told you Marquez was still a great fighter and he had mannys number and not to write him off in this fight (coxy with his arly manny KO nonsense). Boxing is a joke - you can't beat the house unless it's by KO.

You won't be disappointed, BoxingFan. Well, not until the cards are read out.

Sugar Boy Sweetie wrote:Told you Marquez was still a great fighter and he had mannys number and not to write him off in this fight (coxy with his arly manny KO nonsense). Boxing is a joke - you can't beat the house unless it's by KO.

Bingo.

Not that I have anything to chirp about, mind. I believed Marquez to have been a spent force. Now you all know why I don't enter the Prediction league.

Don't think it was a robbery in the slightest, you could certainly argue Pacquiao won the fight, HBO team had Manny up by a few rounds,

I knew it was going to happen, there was no way Marquez would get the W. I thought he won the last 2 fights (my view). Lets be honest if you look at marquez record from that point of view he beat the best fighter in the world 3 times. Many people say he lost a hometown decision to John in John's hometown. In his prime marquez only lost to Mayweather (Which is no shame at all, everyone does...). Great great fighter and the sport is going to miss him when he retires. I said to myself that I would be happy if he could put on a good showing, but from what I have heard he got blatently robbed and he put all that effort in to not get a fair stab. When you watch 24/7 and you see the hard work put in its a wonder the judges can sleep at night when they do this to a fighter.

A lot more people didn't.

I guess the PED talk will stop now.

I had Marquez winning, but I think he lost the decision in the last 4 rounds, where Pacquiao for the first time was beginning to control the pace of the fight.

dont know which is worse, the decision or how i feel in work this morning having stayed up and watched it!!

i thought i was being generous giving pacman 3 rounds all the rest for jmm. very poor by pac who didnt seem to have any ideas. its not like they have not fought before. cant see how he would beat mayweather after a performance like that. i thought he had improved alot since the last jmm fight, perhaps it was just his oppostion flattering him. if mayweather doesnt jump at the chance to make the fight now it will never happen.