Has Haye-Chisora changed British boxing for the worse ??

Two losers brawling in public.......segregated by a fence at the press conference......A build up of phoney hostility and then snogging later on.....Morons calling it the fight of the century even though one guy had lost his last three fights and the other bottled his biggest test!!

But now...........

Posters are on here salivating about a war of words between fury and Haye...WTF !!!...Fury is saying it's the biggest fight because they have the two biggest gobs in Britain!!

Are people turning into wrestling fans or what ??...

I don't care what Haye says or the big wally says...I'm interested in the fight....and who wins and how..

Has Haye-Chisora showed us that talent doesn't matter ..Just being w*****s enough??

Or am I some grumpy bitter old sad sack purist.............

TRUSSNUTS wrote:Or am I some grumpy bitter old sad sack purist

For me, you could delete the "purist" part.

Complain all you like about Haye/Chisora, but when the likes of Cleverley are defending their world titles for the sixth time and no-one has the slightest interest in it, I think boxing is on it's ar$e.

When Warren is then claiming that his fighter is more avoided that the guy who gave Jimmy Saville his job at the BBC, there's serious questions that need to be asked and it's got sack all to do with Haye or Chisora

Haye has got bags of talent -and that clearly was just stage, as post fight these two have become friends and exchanged words in good humour.

I wouldn't pay any attention to what Fury says, he would trash talk about himself if you put him in a room with a mirror.

Some fighters, they just need to do this to build themselves up, to get themselves where they need to be psychologically, that's just part of their pre fight ritual. A lot of the time a fight is won before guys get in the ring and this helps their psychology.

Ali is known for his talking before and during a fight, it was part of his persona. Look at some of the things Roberto Duran said and did before during and after fights. This isn't a new thing.

You're being very hard on Haye here I think.

DAVE667 wrote:

TRUSSNUTS wrote:Or am I some grumpy bitter old sad sack purist

Complain all you like about Haye/Chisora, but when the likes of Cleverley are defending their world titles for the sixth time and no-one has the slightest interest in it, I think boxing is on it's ar$e.

For me this is more about tv coverage. Carl Froch has fought all comers and been in some classics. The problem is people don't get to see them. If these guys were fighting month in and month out on the tv boxing in the UK would be so much healthier, fighters would be getting paid more, and with big purses and the public clamouring for competition big domestic fights would get made with regularity. That for me is the real issue.

I tell you this much, both fighters blagged that fight. Neither are proven elite boxers, but both have elite mouths.

BlakkMamba wrote:Haye has got bags of talent -and that clearly was just stage, as post fight these two have become friends and exchanged words in good humour.

I wouldn't pay any attention to what Fury says, he would trash talk about himself if you put him in a room with a mirror.

Some fighters, they just need to do this to build themselves up, to get themselves where they need to be psychologically, that's just part of their pre fight ritual.  A lot of the time a fight is won before guys get in the ring and this helps their psychology.

Ali is known for his talking before and during a fight, it was part of his persona.  Look at some of the things Roberto Duran said and did before during and after fights.  This isn't a new thing.

You're being very hard on Haye here I think.

Talent or not he bottled his biggest test and chisora was a perennial loser..........and it was a much eagerly awaited fight because they were gobby and brawled in public..

davidemore wrote:I tell you this much, both fighters blagged that fight. Neither are proven elite boxers, but both have elite mouths.

Errrr

Haye was WBA World Champion, unified cruiserweight champion.

Pretty Elite.

ANyway, I agree with Truss on the mouth issue. I really couldn't care less who/what "characters" these two make of themselves, it shouldn't be the prerequisite to fighting. That should be left to their ranking and ability. Haye by some distance the more deserving of the payday given that if he rematched Wlad he'd probably have a better chance and that he'd beat Vitali whereas Fury would get beaten by both, very easily.

Agree mostly but disagree, mainly disagree on the points because Truss doesn't like Haye, but we can't all like everyone.

I'm one of the few on here who ranks Haye as an alltime Brit great...

So you're wrong Jabby..

Talent or not he bottled his biggest test

So did Michael Spinks and he doesn't get half the grief Haye does.

If we're talking about p!$$poor showings in Superfights, you couldn't get much worse than Spinks...and he didn't have a poorly toe!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Might be news to you...But Mike Spinks is one of the top 3 175ers of alltime.......and his legacy has suffered as a result..It's all many remember him for..

Bad example my friend.

I'm one of the few on here who ranks Haye as an alltime Brit great...

So you're wrong Jabby..

Yeah Jabby, you're confusing TRUSS with one of his numerous aliases...unless you're also one of his aliases and then it's all a bit too convoluted for me to bother with.

Like DAVE669..

I don't think he bottled his biggest test, he showed up and threw punches, he didn't throw enough to win the fight, Wlad was quicker and more mobile than he was expecting, but I don't think he gave the disgraceful showing a lot of people seem to think it was. Wlad was holding on in the 12th for goodness sake after haye caught him flush.

Don't get me wrong Wlad won convincingly but he's a massively gifted athlete. To fall short at the highest hurdle is no shame. He has proved he is the best at one weight, and fought the best at another weight.

If we had a few more fighters like this boxing would be in better shape not worse.

Haye is an alltime brit great. Behind Carl Froch he is the best fighter of this generation of boxers who came through as pro's in the early 2000's and he has been a genuine two weight world champion. He deserves a lot more respect than he gets.

Oh, I meant that you didn't like his personality Truss, well aware of your (correct) view that he ranks as #2 ATG cruiser

Might be news to you...But Mike Spinks is one of the top 3 175ers of alltime.......and his legacy has suffered as a result..It's all many remember him for..

Bad example my friend.

And Haye was a fine CW too. He also utilised smart (albeit dull) tactics to overcome the biggest size disparity in World HW boxing history...and he still get's a dog's abuse

DAVE667 wrote:

Might be news to you...But Mike Spinks is one of the top 3 175ers of alltime.......and his legacy has suffered as a result..It's all many remember him for..

Bad example my friend.

And Haye was a fine CW too. He also utilised smart (albeit dull) tactics to overcome the biggest size disparity in World HW boxing history...and he still get's a dog's abuse

I couldn't agree more.

DAVE667 wrote:

Might be news to you...But Mike Spinks is one of the top 3 175ers of alltime.......and his legacy has suffered as a result..It's all many remember him for..

Bad example my friend.

And Haye was a fine CW too. He also utilised smart (albeit dull) tactics to overcome the biggest size disparity in World HW boxing history...and he still get's a dog's abuse

hold the press...haye is in the same league as Spinks..

Prime Mike Tyson is as daunting as a Sanders slapped Wlad..

You're being a bit naughty here Truss and putting spin on this.

What Dave is saying, quite correctly in my opinion, is that Spinks was a world class LHW, Haye was a world class Cruiser.

Both went up to Heavy and faced the best men around and both lost.

There is no shame in that for either of them in my book. People being derided for trying and losing is the reason that Nathan Cleverley is on the 6th defence of an anonymous belt against anonymous fighters - that attitude makes people scared to take risks.

You're being a bit naughty here Truss and putting spin on this

TRUSS's favourite past-time...

.............Pops Johnson..Dwight Qawi and the best 175 pounders for five years and then beating the great Larry Holmes..........Is the same as CRUISERWEIGHT Mormeck and Valuev..

Tyson was regarded as maybe the best heavy of alltime when spinks fought him past his prime..Wlad had been squashed already..

You can only beat what is in front of you and Haye squashed everyone he fought at cruiserweight. When he faced Mormeck (in France) he had lost once in ten years. So I hardly think he's some washout.

No one is trying to make the argument that Haye is better than Spinks, but the fact you are even comparing the two is a great flattery to Haye.

I didn't bring Spinks into it......

I can compare Mayweather to Buckley ...and that would flatter Buckley??

I hardly think Spinks is to Haye what Mayweather is to Buckley.

Would Spinks beat Haye at Heavy?

No but my comparison wasn't flattering...

You be gettin' dizzy wit all dat spinnin' son.

No-one disputes Spinks LH credentials..and you yourself dispute at least one of his win's over Big Pants Lar.

...and you're contradicting yourself by saying Haye deserves more credit for being undisputed CW Champion and the WBA champion then deriding his opposition.

perhaps more sugar might sweeten you up sweetie!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/queensberry-rules-boxing-blog/2013/jun/19/is-trash-talking-ruining-boxing

No I'm comparing Spinks to Haye..........Like I said Haye is a Brit alltime great...

Sorry If that is hard for you to follow..

I think we're getting off the point here.

I take my share of the blame.

You can take all of it..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:You can take all of it..

Luckily I've got broad shoulders.

But TRUSSY has a 92 inch chest

Normal...not expanded.

Didn't think that needed clarification, fella!

That's slim for an american though right?

It's always uncomfortable to comment on a thread when you want to reply to the OP, but realise the discussion has evolved to Truss' chest size.

Wait till they go lower down..

...and they find that its much like most Americans, all talk and no substance

I remember at the time of Haye Chisora those of us who were critical of the match, the way it had come around and the Luxembourg thing were shouted down as grumpy old miserabalists.

Rowley wrote:I remember at the time of Haye Chisora those of us who were critical of the match, the way it had come around and the Luxembourg thing were shouted down as grumpy old miserabalists.

It was just an observation Rowley, unrelated to the Haye chisora Fiasco

I dont think, they changed boxing for the worst anymore than Ali calling Frazier Uncle Tom did. Anymore than Tyson threatening to eat peoples children did. If a Promotion match between essentially the #21 & #22 team in England can draw 90, 000 at the Wembley, then I see nothing wrong with the #1 & 3 boxers drawing 30, 000.

I think the Haye Vs Harrison was more damaging, at least Chisora was competitive...

Your points ring true though Lenny, they didn't deserve to be billed under a super fight but even though this is true...it was great wasn't it! I enjoyed it and if Haye Vs Fury is anything like this in terms of build up and actual interest generated, I'm all for it!! certainly beats any other fight I can think of outside of Mayweather-Canelo even though I am oddly excited for Malignaggi-Broner tomorrow!

I'll ignore the idiot...Kingy you're wrong......Tyson the boxer sold the fight with Lewis not the hype...

The only reason Haye-Chisora sold was because of the abuse and the scuffle...

At the end of the day threatening to shoot someone physically is quite a serious thing to do

Yes but It wasn't sold on hype...

I didn't dispute that. What I said is that I don't think their scuffle hurt boxing anymore than those events. I mean, the hype for Broner-Paulie is based soley who on slapped Pamela, or whatever her name is better.... And I think that in realistic terms, they are further down the welterweight list than Haye and Chisora are in the Heavies.

Good points but I'm saying..That Haye-Chisora was a fight between losers.....That was big because of the scuffling, glass throwing etc.......

Gives off the vibe that this kind of thing sells....and gives boxing a bad name..

Glass throwing?

Glass was chucked and Booth got a nice cut..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Glass was chucked and Booth got a nice cut..

Thought the Booth cut was from Hayes tripod juggling act. Dont recall any glasses being thrown

It must have been pretty embarrassing though for English fight fans. The Klit bros sitting there all well behaved and those 2 yobbos going at it

The actual boxing match itself was just as much as an embarrassment

Nevermind at least we got Haye v Fury to look forward to hey...