Between Now and 2015 Rugby World Cup! ! !

by majesticimperialman Tue 18 Oct 2011, 9:52 pm

Will/Can all NH teams either keep playing the same type of rugby or better than they have played in this years rugby world cup?

Take Wales for an example. Now i am not having a go at Wales at all.

First of all Wales have played some of the best if not theeee best rugby in any rugby world cup. The question is dispite what goes on this friday, if they get 3rd place or 4th place will they beable to keep this style of rugby up after the tournament is over, and keep it up till 2015 rugby world cup.

England/Ireland well lets face both of these teams WILL HAVE, to play better than they have played in this years tournament to even get a chance of getting any form of silver ware in 2015 rugby world cup.

France, well weather we like it or not they are through to the final of this years rugby world cup.But after sunday 1st or 2nd place, will they get any better between now and 2015.

Scotland/Italy I do believe that both these 2 teams will improve between now and 2015. Will they improve enough to win any titles first place or second place? I realy do not know.

So will all of the NH teams beable to improve/play better rugby between now and 2015 Rugby World Cup?

by TycroesOsprey Tue 18 Oct 2011, 10:07 pm

I think the next four years are going to be exciting.

France will improve dramatically with PSA as coach.

England, well once the civil war is over who knows what English rugby will look like. Sadly I think they will go for Sir Clive but I think thats yet anpother retograde step.

Ireland will need to rebuild but the provinces are strong so I expect them to still perform well.

Scotland are not as bad as the RWC suggests but they need a shake up in coaching terms, Townsend needs to get these guys scoring tries or sombody else needs to be brought in.

Italy will continue to improve with exposure to the prorabo league I wonder who they are going to appoint coach.

Wales should kick on from this world cup with a young squad they could dominate the next few years 6nations with France. I have a feeling the Ozzies and Wales will be in the final in 2015. Both have very young squads that will only get better.

by mystiroakey Tue 18 Oct 2011, 11:11 pm

they havent played well- so hopefully they can sort it out and improve in a big way- wales are still losing a high percentage of games- its certainly not consitant rugby, no different from france or england on nad form(one good game, then one bad one)

england have the resources to improve- and anyone writing them of is a mug. they will be so geared up for a rwc at home- all the 6n's from here on will be contested by them

the only good performance by one side was ireland v aus- and all of us nh teams can and do beat them anyway- things have got to improve, no team has really been matched up against the sh in the knock outs so we havent learnt enough from this world cup.

and when we do get the match up in the final i predict a battering by the all blacks.

room for improvement isnt really the word here- we need to go up several notchs- and the only two teams that can get to that level(the all blacks) is england or france- will they- not sure- but they can

by maestegmafia Tue 18 Oct 2011, 11:23 pm

mystiroakey wrote: and the only two teams that can get to that level(the all blacks) is england or france- will they- not sure- but they can

You'll have to explain that statement because it makes absolutely no sense without a thorough explanation...!

by mystiroakey Tue 18 Oct 2011, 11:27 pm

maestegmafia wrote:
mystiroakey wrote: and the only two teams that can get to that level(the all blacks) is england or france- will they- not sure- but they can

You'll have to explain that statement because it makes absolutely no sense without a thorough explanation...!

what are you trying to say lad that other nations in the NH have resourecs to get to the all blacks level- lol, dont even try pal. They are just to good at present- as there national game and there constant island robbing tactics (who seem perfectly breed for rugby) the samller NH countries have less that zero chance of getting to that level- but because france and england have alot of money, alot of resource, alot of pros,coaches to choose from, and alot of draw to also poach- well its just obvious!!

by maestegmafia Tue 18 Oct 2011, 11:36 pm

Have a look at this Kiwi Rugby website and see which teams are thought of as the toughest opponents for the All Blacks.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby

by mystiroakey Tue 18 Oct 2011, 11:37 pm

did i - i am just a realist, you are just way over exited about the way wales have actually strung 2 or so wins together for the first time in a few years, your getting caught up in all this welsh love at the moment- people honestly think wales have played goodf rugby and yes they have played some nice stuff- but compare yourselfs to the all blacks- drop me out its chalk and cheese

england and frnace have the resources to get to that sort of level, they are not there at presnet and may never get there as at present they are underacheiving under there respective regimes..

by maestegmafia Tue 18 Oct 2011, 11:42 pm

mystiroakey wrote:

england and frnace have the resources to get to that sort of level, they are not there at presnet and may never get there as at present they are underacheiving under there respective regimes..

To be honest England and France have been "on a level" with All Blacks as often as Wales have in the last fifty years despite the ridiculous amount of money in the English and French game. Why you think that might change anything I really don't know.

If I was you mate, I wouldn't be bragging about the glory of English rugby at the moment, there is very very little to brag about....!

by mystiroakey Tue 18 Oct 2011, 11:46 pm

err have i bragged about anything, not sure what you are reading

whats this 50 years talk- the game has only been professional for x amount!! when have wales been up there in that period of time!!

seriously get a grip

by maestegmafia Tue 18 Oct 2011, 11:53 pm

Sounds like England's current performance is really getting to you, despite having "the resources to get to that sort of level", or "because france and england have alot of money, alot of pros, coaches to choose from, and alot of draw to also poach- well its just obvious!!"....!

This appears to be a very good time to add you to the ignore list...!

by mystiroakey Tue 18 Oct 2011, 11:57 pm

be my guest- just saying it how it is, not sure what your problem is?

by Runster Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:04 am

mystiroakey wrote:
maestegmafia wrote:
mystiroakey wrote: and the only two teams that can get to that level(the all blacks) is england or france- will they- not sure- but they can

You'll have to explain that statement because it makes absolutely no sense without a thorough explanation...!

what are you trying to say lad that other nations in the NH have resourecs to get to the all blacks level- lol, dont even try pal. They are just to good at present- as there national game and there constant island robbing tactics (who seem perfectly breed for rugby) the samller NH countries have less that zero chance of getting to that level- but because france and england have alot of money, alot of resource, alot of pros,coaches to choose from, and alot of draw to also poach- well its just obvious!!

Yeah, mystery, you've got all those resources (loasamoney!!!), so how come England are Shiite? What's gonna change that hasn't changed since 2003 - 7 long years?

by Runster Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:05 am

If England are so awesome, how come the win tally with wales is about equal?

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:06 am

i dunno- its bad i admit it is. we can only blame ourselves for getting it wrong- time for an overhaul

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:07 am

Runster wrote:If England are so awesome, how come the win tally with wales is about equal?

who is saying they are awesome?

by maestegmafia Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:20 am

Paul Acford wrote:ENGLAND

Ben Foden: Added depth from the back occasionally but half the player without his mate Ashton beside him. Armitage applying real pressure. 6/10

Matt Banahan: Not as good as last week and that wasn’t great. One of a number of England bangers with not much else. 4

Mike Tindall (capt): Brave, honest but England need more than that in midfield. Butchered one attack with a forward pass. Come in Tuilagi. 5

Shontayne Hape: Unsettled and unsure of himself despite a decent number of Tests behind him. Flutey no better. A real problem for Johnson. 3

Mark Cueto: Tried to play football but swamped by a rampant Welsh defence. Wouldn’t get near the All Black side. 5

Toby Flood: Predictable and tired-looking. On this showing Wilkinson is a far better bet to start against Argentina. 4

Richard Wigglesworth: Started with an iffy fifty-fifty pass and went backwards from there. Care came on and was far more impressive. 3

Alex Corbisiero: Part of a good scrummaging effort in the first half but hands let him down again. Won’t keep out Sheridan. 5

Steve Thompson: Very efficient at the lineout and turned the screw at scrum-time. Plenty of effort but little penetration elsewhere. 5

Dan Cole: Gave James a real run around for the first half. But also one of a number of England players who made mistakes when accuracy required. 6

Louis Deacon: Must be sick as a pig. Provided all that ball, dominated all that territory but for what? 6

Courtney Lawes: Tremendous source of possession at the back of the lineout but didn’t dent defences out wide as Johnson hoped he would. 6

Tom Wood: Part of a back row which was outplayed by the Welsh trio. That said, he is one of England’s more instinctive footballers up front. 6

Hendrie Fourie: Wasn’t able to work out what referee wanted at the breakdown which is very limiting for an openside. An opportunity missed. 4

Nick Easter: Looks a bit tubby to me in that tight white shirt. Usual soft hands didn’t help much against claustrophobic attention from Wales. 5

WALES

James Hook: Fabulous game. Scored a try, kicked two great long-range penalties and was all that England weren’t. 8

George North: Still ridiculously young but looks like he knows what he’s doing on a rugby pitch. Strong on the ball. 7

Jamie Roberts: Another excellent effort. Doughty and determined and got Wales going forward again in crucial second half spell. 8

Gavin Henson: Was looking just fabulous before he went off with a damaged right wrist on the half hour. 7

Shane Williams: One great defensive effort against the dumper truck that is Banahan summed up the Welsh attitude. Seems ageless. 7

Rhys Priestland: Looks better by the minute. Another player who went off injured when he was playing sweetly. Has sped up the rankings. 8

Mike Phillips: At last, a performance to match his talent. Bossed the breakdown and looked interested and up for it. 7

Paul James: Had a horrible time for a while at the scrum but didn’t stop him getting stuck in in the loose. Feisty. 6

Lloyd Burns: Just started his Test career and had a poor one. No coincidence that Wales improved hugely when Bennett replaced him. 3

Craig Mitchell: Better than last week but couldn’t have been any worse. Very much second choice to the hairy monster, Adam Jones. 4

Luke Charteris: Stuck at it but was put under an awful lot of pressure by England’s tight forwards. 5

Alun-Wyn Jones: Still in search of form. Still not managing to fire up the Welsh scrummaging effort. Maybe just biding his time for New Zealand. 4

Dan Lydiate: A stunning match. Won the turnover which thwarted final England attack and a real pain in the arse throughout. Great stuff. 8

Sam Warburton: Outstanding. Seems to grow in confidence and stature towards the end of the match. 8

Toby Faletau: Better than last week because he was not as isolated. Welsh back row worked well as a unit. 7

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:27 am

not sure what point you are trying to make- the kiwis are the benchmark. measure yourself against them

by emack2 Wed 19 Oct 2011, 3:35 am

Not quite sure where your going with this but a few thoughts anyway.
The current RFU and various reviews need sorting out,including getting a settled structure from top /down.
Manager/Coaches need settling,then looking at team selection I am talking mainly about England here.But there will be many new faces in the 6Ns when it restarts with a lot of the stalwarts gone.
Before judging your teams performance,temper it with realistic expectations.
England a good performance in the pool stages,maybe SF exit 2015 should be better.Ireland,Scotland,Wales,to get out of there groups maybe SF stage if lucky.
France a SF exit,plus a good group performance etc.
Scotland disappointed not getting out of group.Ireland win over Australia but not quite enough for Wales but good try from an ageing side.
Wales a SF was a good result ,and they have plenty to build on.
France the enigma as ever,not really bothered themselves but done enough
to reach the final.Winning RWC for the first time is still not beyond them.
England,the knee jerk reaction will be to sack the coaches and start again,which seems pointless.
They won the 6Ns trying to play balanced Rugby with Toby Flood at 10,come the RWC.
Then its Jonny Wilkinson,safety first ,try nothing Rugby,the myth England has a mighty Pack,at Scrum/Lineout/Breakdown has been found out.
NOW we have 4 years,decide how you want to play,pick the players who can perform it.
Yes ,get the set piece right everything stems from there,then have a couple of Game Plans.The whole squad picked need to do the basics well.
You want a bench mark,the All Blacks,they play simple Basic Rugbyat pace.
The 3 P`s,Position,Posession,Pace,that is the key the speed of the ball beats the man every time.

by Runster Wed 19 Oct 2011, 7:08 am

mystiroakey wrote:
Runster wrote:If England are so awesome, how come the win tally with wales is about equal?

who is saying they are awesome?

You say only Englnd and France have the resources to compete with New Zealand I.e England are capable of being as good as NZ. Well, they have the resources but not the players at the moment, or the coaches or the temperament or the flair. You've just written off Wales and Ireland and Scotland. We love you, mystiroakey, I hope you know that.

by maestegmafia Wed 19 Oct 2011, 8:10 am

Runster,

Your mate obviously doesnt know much about rugby in wales. The way the WRU is making money at the moment, £26million profit this year considering the much smaller pool and population, there are probably more funds available per player in Wales than in England and France. But the main benefit we have is that the regions and clubs want to see successful at international level.

The coaches seem to be doing well to produce skilled young players from the regional academies. Most of the coaches, physios and so on at those regions are welsh too. Welsh coaching team at wasps, rob Howley is apparently taking over at Bath too.

The quality of the training facilities in Wales is becoming pretty spectacular too. The Vale for the national squad is a fantastic centre.

Wales have spent a number of years and a lot of money, more importantly though a hell of a lot of effort by everyone to focus on one thing...! Success at international level.

Wales is moving in the right direction internationally. Everything is geared towards the international team. The regions want the international team to prosper, the directors of rugby and owners of the regional franchises all want their top players to spend more time with Wales from now on and are working out a way to do so.

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 8:52 am

good luck wales- i hope you prove me wrong(well not at the expense of england off course) the kiwis are offcourse also a very small country as well- but they seem to only play this one game, but they also poach any player they want from the islands- you lot are producing some very good footballers which is surely costing your pool of talent for the future as more and more may get involved in footy. but guys you really have to chill out- these are opinions and no disrespect to wales at all.

by Boyne Wed 19 Oct 2011, 9:05 am

1st priority for Wales is actually convincing the locals to go out and support their local team.

by maestegmafia Wed 19 Oct 2011, 9:06 am

Your posts made me laugh not angry.

The illinformed arrogance of them was an absolute gem.

Especially this one it's a beauty, you should start your own thread with it.

mystiroakey wrote:
what are you trying to say lad that other nations in the NH have resourecs to get to the all blacks level- lol, dont even try pal. They are just to good at present- as there national game and there constant island robbing tactics (who seem perfectly breed for rugby) the samller NH countries have less that zero chance of getting to that level- but because france and england have alot of money, alot of resource, alot of pros,coaches to choose from, and alot of draw to also poach- well its just obvious!!

Love the comment about the poaching.

Yes we all know how well you've done there, though I guess that maybe didn't work out quite so well.

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 9:12 am

maestegmafia wrote:Your posts made me laugh not angry.

The illinformed arrogance of them was an absolute gem.

Especially this one it's a beauty, you should start your own thread with it.

mystiroakey wrote:
what are you trying to say lad that other nations in the NH have resourecs to get to the all blacks level- lol, dont even try pal. They are just to good at present- as there national game and there constant island robbing tactics (who seem perfectly breed for rugby) the samller NH countries have less that zero chance of getting to that level- but because france and england have alot of money, alot of resource, alot of pros,coaches to choose from, and alot of draw to also poach- well its just obvious!!

Love the comment about the poaching.

what is illinformed about the truth

its true poaching makes them(the kiwis) much better. You may not like this reality- but its true, all the SH teams do it so do the english, i think you guys were doing it some time ago- but surely its about poaching the best!, i dont think wales have the same draw- sorry but its reality- The kiwis poach the best- they give back ones that arnt good enough(figi and somoa are full of failed kiwis)

by Geordie Wed 19 Oct 2011, 9:18 am

"First of all Wales have played some of the best if not theeee best rugby in any rugby world cup. "

Really? Lets not go over the top eh? They played well but some of the best ever in a world cup.....?? Rolling Eyes

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 9:23 am

its not even close to the best in this world cup- the kiwis play a brand that is alien to the welsh. crazy comment

by EnglishReign Wed 19 Oct 2011, 9:49 am

I think England do have the players, in fact I think they have too many players. Incredibly difficult to pick the best XV, but if they get it right we will be sorted for 2015.

by offload Wed 19 Oct 2011, 9:53 am

EnglishReign wrote:I think England do have the players, in fact I think they have too many players. Incredibly difficult to pick the best XV, but if they get it right we will be sorted for 2015.

Very much agree. England do have many excellent young players and imo something is lacking in the way the talent is nutured at the top level. Get this right and England will always compete with the best.

by emack2 Wed 19 Oct 2011, 10:02 am

Usually in these days of not having Test Trials a Countries most successful clubs/Provinces/franchises.
Is usually the basis for the test side,if you have your best players being non-qualified imports it complicates it a bit.
The Poaching thing is so overdone,and ill informed hardly deserves comment.
Really the nerve of Samoa poaching a New Zealander as a scrum half,like most of the squad.

by emack2 Wed 19 Oct 2011, 10:06 am

Maybe it`s the case of do you pick on form or reputation,there are times you have to be ruthless .
Great Players of the past that don`t fit the gameplan need to be discarded,a spine of veterans is required true.
BUT sometimes too much faith in them is ill placed.

by **Biltong** Wed 19 Oct 2011, 10:16 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:"First of all Wales have played some of the best if not theeee best rugby in any rugby world cup. "

Really? Lets not go over the top eh? They played well but some of the best ever in a world cup.....??

Perhaps he meant the best THEY have played in a world cup. Wink

by offload Wed 19 Oct 2011, 10:22 am

"Perhaps he meant the best THEY have played in a world cup"

Whatever was meant - in previous WC's we didn't come close to the quality performances we have seen this time. One more on Friday would be nice Very Happy

by Runster Wed 19 Oct 2011, 10:56 am

mystiroakey wrote:good luck wales- i hope you prove me wrong(well not at the expense of england off course) the kiwis are offcourse also a very small country as well- but they seem to only play this one game, but they also poach any player they want from the islands- you lot are producing some very good footballers which is surely costing your pool of talent for the future as more and more may get involved in footy. but guys you really have to chill out- these are opinions and no disrespect to wales at all.

FFS, mystiroakey, you just dismissed Wales, Ireland, Scotland and Italy from ever competing at a world cup. Don't tell us to chill out, take back what you said, as it is deeply offensive, and, frankly, wrong.

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:01 am

Runster wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:good luck wales- i hope you prove me wrong(well not at the expense of england off course) the kiwis are offcourse also a very small country as well- but they seem to only play this one game, but they also poach any player they want from the islands- you lot are producing some very good footballers which is surely costing your pool of talent for the future as more and more may get involved in footy. but guys you really have to chill out- these are opinions and no disrespect to wales at all.

FFS, mystiroakey, you just dismissed Wales, Ireland, Scotland and Italy from ever competing at a world cup. Don't tell us to chill out, take back what you said, as it is deeply offensive, and, frankly, wrong.

i can dismiss you from 2015 its only 4 years away!- i am not dismissing anyone long term

obviously wales shouldnt be dismissed in the same way as i/others can dismiss the others you mentioned- but lets be honest here my point was about getting to the kiwi's current level, i cant see any other nation bar the other two s/h teams and england or france getting that level(in that short space of time)- there is allways a chance that the kiwis level could fall back to the pack therefore others could compete with them- or the kiwis could choke(shock/horror)

by EnglishReign Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:04 am

offload wrote:
EnglishReign wrote:I think England do have the players, in fact I think they have too many players. Incredibly difficult to pick the best XV, but if they get it right we will be sorted for 2015.

Very much agree. England do have many excellent young players and imo something is lacking in the way the talent is nutured at the top level. Get this right and England will always compete with the best.

Spot on. We've all seen the skill coached out of many top players, most notably Wilkinson in my opinion. I rewatched his documentary from 2002 recently and was amazed by the way he started as an incredible attacking 10, yet soon became a kicking machine.

Hopefully the new talent can play more freely.

by thebandwagonsociety Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:08 am

Between now and the next world cup Argentina will have some form of competition to compete in. Their levels of display considering they only get a couple of summer and autumn tests puts a lot of sides to shame.

by Runster Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:18 am

mystiroakey wrote:
Runster wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:good luck wales- i hope you prove me wrong(well not at the expense of england off course) the kiwis are offcourse also a very small country as well- but they seem to only play this one game, but they also poach any player they want from the islands- you lot are producing some very good footballers which is surely costing your pool of talent for the future as more and more may get involved in footy. but guys you really have to chill out- these are opinions and no disrespect to wales at all.

FFS, mystiroakey, you just dismissed Wales, Ireland, Scotland and Italy from ever competing at a world cup. Don't tell us to chill out, take back what you said, as it is deeply offensive, and, frankly, wrong.

i can dismiss you from 2015 its only 4 years away!- i am not dismissing anyone long term

obviously wales shouldnt be dismissed in the same way as i/others can dismiss the others you mentioned- but lets be honest here my point was about getting to the kiwi's current level, i cant see any other nation bar the other two s/h teams and england or france getting that level(in that short space of time)- there is allways a chance that the kiwis level could fall back to the pack therefore others could compete with them- or the kiwis could choke(shock/horror)

Well, and you wonder why the English rugby world is so disliked by everyone else..... If England are so much better, why don't they consistently beat Wlaes? Please answer the question. You are 1 ot 2 victories ahead of us in our playing history.

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:20 am

Runster wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:
Runster wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:good luck wales- i hope you prove me wrong(well not at the expense of england off course) the kiwis are offcourse also a very small country as well- but they seem to only play this one game, but they also poach any player they want from the islands- you lot are producing some very good footballers which is surely costing your pool of talent for the future as more and more may get involved in footy. but guys you really have to chill out- these are opinions and no disrespect to wales at all.

FFS, mystiroakey, you just dismissed Wales, Ireland, Scotland and Italy from ever competing at a world cup. Don't tell us to chill out, take back what you said, as it is deeply offensive, and, frankly, wrong.

i can dismiss you from 2015 its only 4 years away!- i am not dismissing anyone long term

obviously wales shouldnt be dismissed in the same way as i/others can dismiss the others you mentioned- but lets be honest here my point was about getting to the kiwi's current level, i cant see any other nation bar the other two s/h teams and england or france getting that level(in that short space of time)- there is allways a chance that the kiwis level could fall back to the pack therefore others could compete with them- or the kiwis could choke(shock/horror)

Well, and you wonder why the English rugby world is so disliked by everyone else..... If England are so much better, why don't they consistently beat Wlaes? Please answer the question. You are 1 ot 2 victories ahead of us in our playing history.

i didnt say we were much better- or even better- just that with the infastructure in place we have a chance to get to the kiws level in time for 2015- lol this is tough work.

by **Biltong** Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:31 am

Mystiroakey - get out while you can Sir. You should know better than to be other than complimentary about other teams.

I have learnt my lesson, if you can't be complimentary, rather don't voice an opinion.

It is OK however to rip your own team apart. thumbsup

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:31 am

by Runster Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:37 am

mystiroakey wrote:lol

Any answers to my question?

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:39 am

Runster wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:lol

Any answers to my question?

its above look up

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 11:43 am

look runster we are going to be at home in 2015 and by the sounds of things so are you to a certain extent- its gonna be a cracking world cup- and will be beneficial if all the HN's are doing well. we also have plenty of 6n's to deal with before then as well- its very interesting- i may be proved wrong, and i will be happy to admit i was wrong if wales win the thing, but my opinion is my opinion at the moment and i will not say things i dont feel just for an easy life on this forum

by Runster Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:08 pm

Mysteri - you didn't answer my question above. Let me ask it again. If England compete at a different level to Wales, why don't they consistently beat Wales at Rugby - why haven't you beaten us on, for exaple, 75% of the occasions on which you have played us in our history?

Looking forward to any replies.

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:18 pm

why are you asking me that question?

by Runster Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:25 pm

Cos you said:-

'i can dismiss you from 2015 its only 4 years away!'

"what are you trying to say lad that other nations in the NH have resourecs to get to the all blacks level- lol, dont even try pal. They are just to good at present- as there national game and there constant island robbing tactics (who seem perfectly breed for rugby) the samller NH countries have less that zero chance of getting to that level- but because france and england have alot of money, alot of resource, alot of pros,coaches to choose from, and alot of draw to also poach- well its just obvious!!"

If england are in New Zealand league, how come you are equal to Wales? Wales are England equal through history, and are currently much superior to them. Don't think anyone would disagree with that last.

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:33 pm

err do you understand english- when have i said we are better than wales, or on the kiwis level!

i have stated yes that you guys have zero chance getting to the level we see today from the kiwis-but england anbd france have a chance- and i totally believe that!!

but i will just make a little point for you

england have won 20 out of the last 27 games against you boys

which lol- haha- is err 75% win ratio Between Now and 2015 Rugby World Cup! ! ! 479796

Between Now and 2015 Rugby World Cup! ! ! 479796

by maestegmafia Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:35 pm

I am sorry but on current standing England do not apparently have either the infrastructure, the coaching or the talent to compete at the top.

They were knocked out in the Quarter finals and struggled to beat Scotland and Argentina in the pools, where they hardly looked convincing against minnow teams like Romania and Georgia.

There is a lack of talent coming through to the top of English rugby, though there is talent at youth level. This sites that the infrastructure really isn't working.

If a nation competes so well at U20s why does that talent not progress to club or International level?

England will need to make a great deal of changes to their set up to be as competitive as their fans expect them to be even within the Six Nations.

The PRL needs to go or be changed dramatically, the RFU need to run the game for the international side to be successful not the Premiership clubs who put their professional interests above the nations.

Of the teams that made the quarter finals of the RWC, two thirds of them have a structure that is solely geared towards their national governing body. That means that academy players progress to a regional level and an international level through a guided system.

Only England, Argentina and France do not have this. THough i expect argentina to change over the next 10 years.

by mystiroakey Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:41 pm

ok mate - you have alot to say about us english- seems to be based on a kind of strange want- but ok i will accept you have opinions.

the proof is allways offcourse in the pudding.

we shall see

by ultra Wed 19 Oct 2011, 12:43 pm

Let me try and help him out here Runster. I beleive that he is alluding to the fact that, if, (and it's a big if), all the NH teams had their infrastuctures sorted, their coaching set ups at the top of their game and their playing resources tapped to the fullest of their potential then probability alone would point to the fact that only england and france could hope to compete at the top, (and the top has to be measured using NZ as a yardstick). I don't believe this chap has said anywhere that england/france are in anyway, shape or form better than any other NH side, just POTENTIALLY.
Now whilst I agree to a point that if everything was as above this may be the case, it never will be and as such is a slightly moot point. OK?

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