Thiem gentleman please, US Open Day 5 and 6

Today we see Shapovalov promoted to Arthur Ashe stadium and take on Kyle Edmund. Mischa Zverev takes on Isner in what is likely to be a match short on service breaks, whilst Querrey, Cilic and Coric are in action. In the womens' Kvitova, Sharapova, Muguruza and Venus are all in action.

Seeded players at risk today? Anderson, who's up against Coric, if the young Croat can back up his win over Alex Zverev.

Think Shap will have too much for Kyle, although it will be interesting to see how he copes with being favourite. Anderson should beat Coric fairly easily. Other matches look comfortable for the favourites.

B'S. The way this USO is going there could be more upsets today. Can't help thinking that certain players (A Zverev, Dimi) have really missed out given the absenteeism.

I feel whoever gets ahead first between Shapovalov and Edmund will go on to win the tie - they're both pretty strong frontrunners. While Shap has the better tools and variety he's played a lot of games recently so you'd think Edmund will have the greater power & stamina if it goes long.

I'm going to back Coric to give Anderson a tough game. I reckon it's the perfect matchup for his counter-punch style. If it was on clay I'd give him a fair chance of winning but Anderson on a HC is possibly a step too far.

I don't expect any of the other top seeds to fall today, although it seems there's been more than one significant upset every day so far!

Got to admit I'm a bit torn on who I want to win out of Shapovalov and Edmund. On the one hand I'm a Brit and want to see Edmund get established higher up the rankings, especially as the Flushing Meadow courts are probably his best surface. On the other hand, the emergence of Shapovalov is great for the game and it would be good for the tournament if he could go on a decent run.

In Edmund's favour, whilst he's not necessarily renowned as great in long matches, if the match goes the distance surely he's got to be favourite given the young Canadian has come through qualifying and is still only 18.

Been watching some clips of the Shapo-Tsonga match and if the Canadian plays like that, Edmund will have little chance. Shapo, though, might find it hard being considered favourite for this match.
   Like Mr Inv, I'm kinda torn about this match, too. Shapo, at 18, is a very exciting, talented player. 
   On fitness, Kyle - also - has had a lot of matches of late.
   I see Kvitova, facing what I thought might have been a tough match against C Garcia, has come thru easily 0 and 4.

Totally agree Shap vs Tsonga was an instant classic, I have high hopes indeed for Le Shap.

Cilic latest seed to be having a tough match. Schwartzman's just levelled their match at one set all.

Edmund v Shapovalov ...... here we go.

Let's hope it's a good one ! I'd have to favour the young Canadian, just seems more of a natural.

Keeping a close eye on the Cilic match too.

Great start by Edmund to take the opener

Wow and whoops so much for no more upsets... Cilic out. What a strange, strange tournament this is shaping up to be...

CILIC OUT. Some people's favourite, Cilic, is out, beaten in four by Schwartzman. The shocks go on.
   Shap levels at one set all v Edmund. Bottom half of draw completely open now. Great chance for someone.

Cilic gone in four sets. Good to see Schwartzman play some excellent tennis.

Yes, impressive win for Schwartzman, coming from a set down.

Another potential threat to Rafa is gone.

Cilic looked bitterly disappointed, very cursory handshake (understandable of course, more so perhaps than some of the overly-friendly ones !)

Oh dear.

A retirement looms, methinks.

Shap's win over Edmund, with the Briton having to retire with a neck injury early in the 4th, takes the Canadian into a 4th round devoid of big names in the bottom half of the draw.
   Cilic joins others who must have fancies their chances. So much for so-called easy draws for some players.

Poor Edmund, shame for him to have to withdraw part way through match, but for Shapovalov, this shortened match is a lucky break and gives him bit of respite - having come through qualifying he's now played 7 matches during his run at Flushing Meadows, and surely must be tiring.

The Cilic result is a bit of a shock.  Schwartzman has developed into a decent solid player but given Cilic's previous experience I was expecting the Croat to go much deeper in this tournament.  We've had so many shocks in this tournament now, I think we'll surely reach a point in next round or 2 when the results start to revert to the form book.  I do think once the dust settles that the way this tournament pans out will work out a treat for Federer or Nadal - should either progress through as expected they will face a rookie in the final.

Regarding the womens, for all the talk of how open it is, I'm starting to get the impression that Muguruza will win the title fairly easily.

My first reaction when I saw Shapovalov's score was "oh my, that is no good, how can he be losing sets to Edmund"?  But then I realized that Edmund is still ahead of him in the rankings, so it was not really so disappointing, and I also realized that I should be dialing back my expectations of Shapovalov a little.

But, on the other hand, with the bottom half as open as it is, surely Shapovalov has some - maybe not massive, but plausible - chance of reaching the final?

Zverev beats Isner in straight sets.

Carreno Busta the highest seed remaining in the bottom half.  Unreal.  Pinch me, somebody.  Every one of the eight players in the bottom half will think they have some chance to make the final.  Maybe not Lorenzi, but the other seven for sure.

The real question is can Fedal catch up with Carreno Busta?

Chapeau to Le Shapo, get behind him, he shows Raonic up as the useless hipster wannabe he is!

Just what is happening in the bottom half of this draw? No sooner is it declared that a player has a cakewalk journey to the final then that player crashes out. 
   Some of the guys in the top half are no doubt wishing they were in the bottom half. Reminds me a bit of Wimbledon in 2002 when seeds crashed left, right and centre and SW19 debutant Nalbandian reached the final.
   We all ought to give up making predictions about this Slam, despite the enticing accompanying topic entitled Bottom Half Finalist?

In Cilic's case it has to remembered that he had not played a tournament since Wimbledon through injury. So no idea how fit and match ready he actually was.

SFP, yes good comparison with Wimbledon 2002 when Nalbandian had his unlikely run to the final and many seeded players crashed out in the early rounds.  Other than that I'm really struggling to think of any other slam tournaments on the mens' side in recent years where so many big names have been injured or have ended up losing in the early rounds.  I guess its testament to how consistent it has been at top of the game over the last few years.  2002-2003 was a real transitional period in the game, between the eras of Sampras and Federer/Nadal, and I wonder whether this tournament paves the way for 2018 to unfold in a similar way.

I think if you look over the last half a dozen slams you see a pattern. New faces have been reaching slam semis/finals and injuries hitting ALL of the big four have led to the situation we are in now. A lot of people are ear-marking Shapovalov as the next big thing (a little quickly in my opinion) but if he is then he has to show it now, here in this tournament by getting to the final. The half of the draw has opened right up for him so there are no excuses. If he is the real deal nothing stands in his way.

So, moving onto Day 6,  plenty of home interest in the womens' with Vandeweghe, Keys, Rogers and Brady in action, although I feel only 1 or 2 of these will come through.  Federer takes on Lopez, who is likely to test him but unlikely to take more than 1 set I would have thought and Nadal should be reasonably comfortable against Mayer.

Does anyone feel Mannarino has a chance of upsetting Thiem?  The Frenchman is having a good year and I'm still not entirely convinced with the Austrian on hardcourts.  Monfils v Goffin, Troicki v Dolgopolov and Bautista Agut v Del Potro look real 50:50 matches to me and either could go the distance.  Andrey Rublev also in action against Dzumhur - will be interesting to see if he can back up his win over Dimitrov.

That seems a bit far Craig. We are talking about an 18 year old who has never won a slam match before this tournament. His fitness can't be incredible and he's had to come through qualies as well. Frankly, getting this far is testament to the fact he's the real deal. Whilst the draw he faces would be child's play for a fit member of the big 4, it's still going to involve a lot of battle hardened match players. I think, despite his exceptional gifts, he is an underdog against PCB in the next round.

Big test for Fed today. On Fed's form of the first two rounds, Lopez will be far too good. The key question is how much of Fed's poor form is injury related and how much is just rustiness. I think we will find out the answer tonight.

Agreed, BornSlippy, to reach 4th round after coming through qualifying is already a big achievement, and I also concur that Carreno Busta is favourite in that match.  Shapavolov's big breakthrough this summer should provide a stepping stone for him to make further progress up the rankings during the autumn indoor season.  The Canadian has already matched the young Zverev's best ever showing at a slam and whatever happens from now on, its been a fantastic tournament for him.  The way he's stormed through qualifying and carried that on through the tournament reminds me of a young Djokovic doing the same back in 2005 when he managed to beat both Ancic and Monfils in the main draw after coming through qualifying.

Born Slippy wrote:That seems a bit far Craig. We are talking about an 18 year old who has never won a slam match before this tournament. His fitness can't be incredible and he's had to come through qualies as well. Frankly, getting this far is testament to the fact he's the real deal. Whilst the draw he faces would be child's play for a fit member of the big 4, it's still going to involve a lot of battle hardened match players. I think, despite his exceptional gifts, he is an underdog against PCB in the next round.

Age is no obstacle to the greats of the sport and Shap is being touted as being potentially that. Now we shall see. Yes fitness may hit him but we shall see. Certainly, Edmund's retirement will have helped as well.

Fed has a far tougher opponent today than on Thursday but may have less trouble. That's the way it goes sometimes. 
   Monfils seems to like the USO and I tip him to edge Goffin. There'll probably be an upset somewhere. How about Thiem losing?

Federer will be tested by Lopez but I doubt whether the Spaniard has it between the ears to win. Nadal should have enough to win in four sets against Mayer.

CaledonianCraig wrote:

Born Slippy wrote:That seems a bit far Craig. We are talking about an 18 year old who has never won a slam match before this tournament. His fitness can't be incredible and he's had to come through qualies as well. Frankly, getting this far is testament to the fact he's the real deal. Whilst the draw he faces would be child's play for a fit member of the big 4, it's still going to involve a lot of battle hardened match players. I think, despite his exceptional gifts, he is an underdog against PCB in the next round.

Age is no obstacle to the greats of the sport and Shap is being touted as being potentially that. Now we shall see. Yes fitness may hit him but we shall see. Certainly, Edmund's retirement will have helped as well.

That's palpably not true though. I don't recall any great getting to the final of the first slam tournament in which they won a match. For all the talent of Federer or Laver, they didn't do it. Laver lost his first 5 slam matches and he's arguably the greatest ever. Age clearly is a barrier. It will be truly remarkable were Shap to make the final - weaker draw or not.

Point taken but the bottom half of the draw has gone beyond decimation. If Shap does not make the final then you can rightly say oh well it was his first slam but also I doubt whether he will ever play in another slam with a more open path to the final.

Come on Craig, you're setting an unrealistic goal for Shapo - what, he has to make the final to show he's the real deal, really?

Beating Nadal and Del Potro in Montreal, getting through USO qualifiers, beating Tsonga and becoming the youngest man to get to the 4th round since Chang in 1989 doesn't count at all I suppose!

What's more it is quite possible there will be a spate of very open slams as the big 4 decline and we hit a transitional era. Come on man, get onboard the Shap train!

reckoner wrote:Come on Craig, you're setting an unrealistic goal for Shapo - what, he has to make the final to show he's the real deal, really?

Beating Nadal and Del Potro in Montreal, getting through USO qualifiers, beating Tsonga and becoming the youngest man to get to the 4th round since Chang in 1989 doesn't count at all I suppose!

What's more it is quite possible there will be a spate of very open slams as the big 4 decline and we hit a transitional era. Come on man, get onboard the Shap train!

This is a slam now - the tournaments that test the mettle more than anything else. If Shap is THE man then he has a fantastic chance now to show it.The players that stand in his way en-route to a final are not ones that should be expected to beat such a rising star. Point is he will not get such a golden chance (draw wise) in his career of that I am certain.

Difficult to know just how GS draws in the future will pan out. It could be that back in 2002, at the Wimbledon mentioned above, there were those saying a young Fed had missed out by beaten in the first round at a tournament where the likes of Agassi and Sampras went out early.
   If Shap develops well, he may not NEED such an open draw in the future, as he will be good enough to beat a stronger field than the one remaining in the bottom half of the draw today.
   I think we can all agree that Shap is a talent. He's so young that he can play the next FIVE slams as a teenager.

MysticCraig wrote:Point is he will not get such a golden chance (draw wise) in his career of that I am certain.

Got next week's lottery numbers too?

reckoner wrote:

MysticCraig wrote:Point is he will not get such a golden chance (draw wise) in his career of that I am certain.

Got next week's lottery numbers too?

It doesn't take Mystic Meg to make that statement. Heck it has opened up so much in that half there is a thread dedicated to it on here. You could play a game of spot the seed as well as so many have gone.

sirfredperry wrote:Difficult to know just how GS draws in the future will pan out. It could be that back in 2002, at the Wimbledon mentioned above, there were those saying a young Fed had missed out by beaten in the first round at a tournament where the likes of Agassi and Sampras went out early.
   If Shap develops well, he may not NEED such an open draw in the future, as he will be good enough to beat a stronger field than the one remaining in the bottom half of the draw today.
   I think we can all agree that Shap is a talent. He's so young that he can play the next FIVE slams as a teenager.

No I would say not as Federer was not being trumpeted so loud as he had been on the circuit for a few years without any notable success in slams. Shap is being trumpeted on here so lets see if he can walk the walk. The chance is certainly there.

Dolgo two sets to love up against Troicki, while Thiem has just taken the first set 7-5 against Mannarino. Pliskova a set down to Zhang but 3-0 up in the second.

sirfredperry wrote:Dolgo two sets to love up against Troicki, while Thiem has just taken the first set 7-5 against Mannarino. Pliskova a set down to Zhang but 3-0 up in the second.

Very welcome ranking points for Dolgopolov if he can come through as he has been sliding down the rankings of late.

Dolgopolov wins in straght sets and Thiem looking good to go two sets up.

Dolgo thru in straights and Pliskova at 5-5 in second set having saved at least one MP.

Thiem : elegant, 'flowing' style of play. Great to watch

Pliskova now level at one set all. Must be favourite to go on to win now. Thiem two sets up.

lags72 wrote:Thiem : elegant, 'flowing' style of play. Great to watch

I would say he has looked best on clay in his career so far so hopefully he can go deep here.Been a bit of an up and down season for him so far.

Thiem thru in straight sets.

Del Potro underway against Bautista-Agut and is a break up at 4-2.

Delpo takes first set 6-3 and Pliskova recovers to win 6-4 in the third.