Ulster 2013/2014

First topic message reminder :

One guy I think deserves high praise from these two Treviso games is Sean Doyle.
As you know I reported some doubt about his future and that he needed to put his hand - he has done so big time.

Few more games like that and he will be with us next year for sure.

No I agree that is the big problem - I think are academy is producing some excellent players but we need a system that produces more half decent ones to back them up.

I suppose this is where the lack of quality in the club system gets exposed.

Anyone have any news on Paddy Wallace's knee?

Did I read somewhere that he had some bother after his run out?

MrsP wrote:Anyone have any news on Paddy Wallace's knee?

Not sure MrsP but I read somewhere that it was spotted between his femur and tibia .....

 

 

Mildly amusing even though not strictly accurate Rodders!

  

Did you ever get the pram?

rodders wrote:

MrsP wrote:Anyone have any news on Paddy Wallace's knee?

Not sure MrsP but I read somewhere that it was spotted between his femur and tibia .....

 

I though they'd found it underneath his headband, rodders?

Asbo!!!

Long time no see!

How apt that you should appear just as knees are being discussed!

Will your very own be putting in an appearance at Lansdowne this year?

MrsP wrote:Asbo!!!

Long time no see!

How apt that you should appear just as knees are being discussed!

Will your very own be putting in an appearance at Lansdowne this year?

Not this year, MrsP, too much training to get thru at the mo to be travelling to away games either for Exe or Scotland. Will you and MrP be gracing us with your presences in Kardipp for the Heino final this year?

No plans to at the moment buddy.

The past few years the HEC Final has fallen on the same day as the Schools Athletics Champs. The lad has been fortunate enough to qualify for that in the past and I wouldn't miss that even for my Ulster.

Looking at the dates just now though it looks like they might not clash this year so, never say never.

geoff998rugby wrote:

Notch wrote:

geoff998rugby wrote:We wont sign Murphy unless he commits to Ireland

Well, thats obvious- Australia won't select him if he moves to Ireland. Similarly Ireland won't select him if he stays in Australia. Unless you're already ineligible to play for Ireland, to sign with Ulster and Ireland is to essentially indicate you are willing to represent Ireland, or to commit to a contract that will see you qualify on residency at the end. I'd imagine the same is true of the Brumbies and other Aussie Super Rugby teams regarding Australia  

To clarify I mean contracturally he will have to commit to Ireland i.e. if he plays for anyone else during the period of his 3 year contract that contract will become null and void.

I see his mum would prefer him to play for Ireland and as you know an Irish lad crossing his mum is not something to be undertaken lightly   

Why would he have to commit contractually? As soon as he moves he no longer qualifies on Residency, and the only country he is eligible for is Ireland?

clivemcl wrote:Nelson and Andrew can cope for some Rabo games, but they aren't versatile.

Nelson has played every position in the outside backs in the past two years and occasionally 10 at school (Rory can confirm), so that's fairly versatile in most people's books. Andrew has been lining out in the centre for the Ravens, that's more experience for him too.

Nelson looks to me to be the most naturally gifted player I've seen at Academy level, but lacks the physique to compete at Senior level right now. Let's hope he isn't another Cochrane who simply isn't powerful enough despite his obvious talent?

Yep Nelson was capped for ulster before all the youngsters iirc. I have always expected him to break through but I'm losing a bit of hope. I would qualify that in respect to the likes of Jackson/Olding etc who have stepped up. Watching him he has never seemed entirely comfortable under the highball and his best performances I can recall (in green) were at centre.

Last season in the preseason game against the tigers a few Leicester ones that came across raved about him

So apparantly Humph is away to London. Guess who Saracens are playing this weekend? Just sayin.

  

some updates:

Understand discussions are in progress with Robinson, Daniels and Murphy
Don't know if any are finalized.

I would be amazed if we do not hear something this week on some of the above and Anscombe

Stephen Ferris is out training today with the squad


Doesn't look good for Paddy Wallace - I think retirement beckons  

geoff998rugby wrote:some updates:

Understand discussions are in progress with Robinson, Daniels and Murphy
Don't know if any are finalized.

I would be amazed if we do not hear something this week on some of the above and Anscombe

Stephen Ferris is out training today with the squad


Doesn't look good for Paddy Wallace - I think retirement beckons  

That's a Love sacks on Paddy but hopefully if he has the mind to, and if he has an aptitude for it there will be future roles in ulster rugby. Great stuff on fez but it starts to get real now. If he can survive running and turning on soggy pitches then our collective hopes will rise.

I would be very pleased if we pulled off those signings (albeit I know little about Murphy). Robinson would be the best of those for me. We would have serious talent all across the backline.

Paddy I would be pretty certain is being lined up for a coaching roll.

I would not be shocked if Doaky goes up the Irish coaching ladder - noticed he was Foley's righthand man for the Wolfhounds.

Would leave a backs coaching spot

Paddy is blessed with a wise rugby brain

Yeah Doak and Foley were announced as Wolfhounds coaches before Christmas I think.

Shame for Paddy because he looked very fit the last time he played but he's had a good run - with other creative midfielders there like Marshall and Olding he'd probably have been down the pecking order anyways...

Great news on Ferris. Touch wood he can get a run of games now and get his career back on track. Still the best 6 around when fit.

So we could realistically field a team of

Court/Black
Herring
Afoa
Tuohy
Muller
Wilson
Diack
Williams
Marshall
Pienaar
Gilroy
Allen?
Cave
Bowe
Payne

During the 6N. Pretty good team

If we have Trimble back I reckon Gilroy will be 15 and Payne 13, with Cave at 12

In the backrow I think Doyle will start and Wilson rested
2nd row I see Stevenson getting a game with Muller, or Tuohy rested

Indeed I wouldn't mind seeing Farrell or Scholes get a run if fit. Nice to have those options though

I would expect to see Farell and Scholes getting run outs, probably from the bench, during the 6N period.

Cave at 12 again ...I wonder is this being influenced by Joe Schmidt?

I think it is simply the fact Marshall, Olding and Wallace are not available.

Cave has zero chance of playing 12 for Ireland.
He was there for the Wolfhounds because after Marshall and D'Arcy we fall of a cliff ability wise (given Oldings injury)

Saturday 5th April 18:30

No more to be said

Brilliant timing- I work until 5 on a lot of Saturdays.

Should have mentioned I am pretty certain it will be Fitzpatrick at 3 not Afoa for the Ospreys match

Schmidt wants Bowe and Fitz up to speed and avaialble for the England match

Afoa will be away home and back for the last two games in February when, hopefully Fitzpatrick has joined the Irish squad

News on other thread suggest three signings have been finalised, one contract renewed and one on the way out.

But... it is from the other thread so...

Saw that - not really saying anything new though

3 New signings - Daniels, Murphy, Robinson
Renewed - Anscombe
Leaving - Muller

That is the buzz but nothing finalized yet.
Does seem Ulster are a bit tighter re gossip this year.
Frustrating for us but understable if they are keeping things closer to their chest

What is interesting is not heard anything recently re a NIQ Lock of a Project/IQ TH.

Maybe, just maybe, waiting on news re tournament formats and income for next year ??
Just a thought

I'd have thought for sure the uncertainty around the tournaments would have an impact on recruitment Geoff ...I mean would you sign for a side which potentially may not have a competition to play in?

Agreed.

It seems we are committed to the 3 new guys but other signings are dependant on resolution to the organizational mess.

We will be playing in a Pro'nn' but who they are and the quality of the opposition is debatable

geoff998rugby wrote:some updates:

Understand discussions are in progress with Robinson, Daniels and Murphy

I'm undecided by the Daniel proposition.
A Plumtree favourite & relieved of the Sharks captaincy, He'll have a job imposing himself ahead of the new Vice Captain Jean Deysel and young Mtembu (both had standout performances against Saracens).
Experienced, intelligent & lightning fast, pound for pound a great player to have in your squad.
Jake White will have the luxury of bringing him on to speed up attacks alongside big powerful runners.

I could see him working well off Big Nick & Henry/Wilson on a dry surface. However Diack & Daniel would be a lightweight 68 combo in a dog fight.

Any thoughts Biltong?!!

dw7 wrote:

geoff998rugby wrote:some updates:

Understand discussions are in progress with Robinson, Daniels and Murphy

I'm undecided by the Daniel proposition.
A Plumtree favourite & relieved of the Sharks captaincy, He'll have a job imposing himself ahead of the new Vice Captain Jean Deysel and young Mtembu (both had standout performances against Saracens).
Experienced, intelligent & lightning fast, pound for pound a great player to have in your squad.
Jake White will have the luxury of bringing him on to speed up attacks alongside big powerful runners.

I could see him working well off Big Nick & Henry/Wilson on a dry surface. However Diack & Daniel would be a lightweight 68 combo in a dog fight.

Any thoughts Biltong?!!

I don't think we would use him at 8.  He can play 6 and 7, so he would probably become first choice 6 with Williams or Wilson at 8 and he would make a great backup to Henry at 7.  When Henry has been out this season we've had to play Doyle at 7 and against top teams....the sort of team you meet in the HC knockouts, Doyle isn't really up to it.  

So the options for the backrow were he here now would be something like:

6 - Daniel, Diack, Wilson
7 - Henry, Daniel, Doyle
8 - Williams, Wilson, Daniel

Hopefully Ferris will come into the mix as well, but even if Ferris makes it he won't be playing every game, or anything like it.

You are right there dodger - the remit was always for a 6/7 player

6 - Diack, Daniel
8 - Williams, Wilson
7 - Henry, Daniel

With Ferris, hopefully, and Henderson, when not in the 2nd row, as a bonus.

Keegan Daniel - another player who will not be on the bench. He is one of the most skilful back row forwards in world rugby.

I have to say, Ulster do seem to be filling the squad with a lot of very good foreign signings - however is this going to stall the development of some of our players? Lets be honest, the likes of Daniel (at 6, 7 or 8) and Robinson (if Payne were to move to 13) are better players than their competition.

It looks increasingly like Ulster are becoming very business like. Is it too far to suggest that they even maybe view country sucess as secondary to club success?

We could always whell out the old argumnent that these foreigners are effectivly coaches and mentors to the homegrown hmmmm...

But yea, I'm actually not THAT bothered. Is that bad?

I think we need better quality in our squad behind the 1st XV, and we seem to be doing that, and better than most other clubs.

Prepare to take some slack for it though.

I feel for Diack - he has been a God-send this season so far.

I'd be happy to see Wilson drop down the pecking order more than Diack. Williams also needs to regain some of his fercoity of last season if he is to keep the 8 shirt also. On form - Diack should not miss out. Not when Daniel can play 8.

Check out his try at 3:23 here lol!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsRgMng6NpU

Think it should be remembered that we are losing players after this season. Afoa, Muller and Court. Although Court is IQ, the other two are not, and so we are replacing the NIQ quota in accordance with IRFU NIQ limits.

We still need to get the signings approved by the IRFU. If they agree, I think it's fine. It's counter-balanced by investment in our Academy which will hopefully pay off down the line.

I feel like this Six Nations we are providing more quality players to the 34-man squad than we ever have before- and thats with Craig Gilroy having been dropped, Tommy Bowe out injured and with Tom Courts Ireland career now dead.

I don't think Daniel has to be considered a cert for any first XV spot. Let's face it if a certain mr ferris returns he will be decidedly fortunate and Diack is coming into his prime. He is there to provide class but also depth.

Same goes for Robinson. He can't be guaranteed anything although I suspect he is good enough to command a start.

Daniel is hopefully being signed primarily as an openside, because Ulster had to convert Henry to fill that role, and Faloon, Birch and Doyle have successively failed to provide competitive back-up. If he's signed it could be Henry who is under more pressure than Diack.

[quote="Artful_Dodger"]

dw7 wrote:

geoff998rugby wrote:Understand discussions are in progress with Robinson, Daniels and Murphy

Hold up. What's their full names so those who are to busy to keep up with the flow can google?

Keegan Daniel, ...... Robinson and ....... Murphy?


Also, new Ravenhill looking bloody brilliant.

JayMaster3000 wrote:

Artful_Dodger wrote:

dw7 wrote:

geoff998rugby wrote:Understand discussions are in progress with Robinson, Daniels and Murphy

Hold up. What's their full names so those who are to busy to keep up with the flow can google?

Keegan Daniel, ...... Robinson and ....... Murphy?


Also, new Ravenhill looking bloody brilliant.

Keegan Daniel - Natal Sharks
Robbie Robinson - Waikito Chiefs
Ruaidhri Murphy - ACT Brumbies

Keegan Daniel will be first choice 6 unless Ferris is available
His other roll will be play 7 when Henry is injured/with Ireland.
Tough on Diack but in practise with only 5 front line backrowers - Daniel, Wilson, Williams, Henry and Diack himself (yon cant count Ferris) in practise he will get plenty of game time, like this year

Wilson is going to be told he has to take a pay cut - currently the best paid player in the squad who is not a foreigner or on a central contract.
I think he will.

Also remember Paddy Wallace likely to retire.
Nothing to convince me, so far, that Bronson Ross is going to come good
Imo we have a few surplus backs who will not be renewed contract wise but, I think that is more likely next year rather than this.

Farrell having an op so almost certaintly out for the season

Of course no one has signed yet, that I have heard, and remember we believed we had Peel, Andress and Jane in the bag and ended up with Pienaer, Afoa and Payne ! (That worked out rather well didn't it!!)

I have to add to Geoff's last post - and say that if Paddy Wallace is to retire - I think he will be missed.

Geoff you mentioned earlier (somewhere on this thread I think) that PW may get a coaching role? I hope so - I played in a team with his brother, and they were a great rugby family. Perhaps being immersed in the game for so long is why he has such a good rugby mind.

Anyhow - any takers for a pint in Davy Byrne's on Sunday?

Artful_Dodger wrote:

JayMaster3000 wrote:

Artful_Dodger wrote:

dw7 wrote:

geoff998rugby wrote:Understand discussions are in progress with Robinson, Daniels and Murphy

Hold up. What's their full names so those who are to busy to keep up with the flow can google?

Keegan Daniel, ...... Robinson and ....... Murphy?


Also, new Ravenhill looking bloody brilliant.

Keegan Daniel - Natal Sharks
Robbie Robinson - Waikito Chiefs
Ruaidhri Murphy - ACT Brumbies

I watched Robbie play for Southland when I lived there a few years back, when he was breaking onto the scene, and was a class act then. As a high profile Southland player I always liked to keep an eye on him in Super Rugby, and every time I seen him he was either excellent or solid.

Not sure where he is going to fit in though? Fullback mostly in Super Rugby and a few starts at 10 and a few less at centre for Southland.

Know very little about the other two.

From what I can tell, this means absolutely nothing - no indication they know anything more than us general forum users. In fairness, what do you expect from a website with a broken link to their main logo image...

But just to keep the Ulster chat alive, I though I'd share.

http://wordinsport.com/index.php/ulster-swoop-for-brumbies-ruaidhri-murphy/

Believe Murphy is a done deal not sure why it has not been announced

Maybe they are waiting for clearance from the Ulster Medical staff which is tricky to arrange with him on the other side of the world?

Good point.

Don't they usually do the announcement in the 6N break weekends so as not to disrupt the international camp?

Another good point.

I reckon we could get up to 4, or 5. announcments between matches 2 and 3