Who has the bigger dilemma?...and over who??

It's been clear for a while that Olly will face a difficult time in making his Captains picks (not too long to go now either). However just listened to PM being interviewed and it was pointed out that he is currently in the last automatic place for the US Team, IF he has a poor weekend he could conceivably fall out of the automatic picks. If you were DL3 would you leave out Phil if he needed a pick??

I think Love would be very tempted to pick the top twelve on his points list, but am sure he'd pick Phil.

Right now, the top 12 are:
Mahan (missed the cut)
Stricker
Furyk
Fowler (missed the cut)

followed by:
Sneds (missed the cut)
Duston
BVP

Ouch...who does he leave out?? I think he does have a tougher call than Olly.

For the record I'd take Phil if he wasn't an automatic although I would have a searching chat with him to ensure he felt he would perform. If he was honest enough to say he wasn't on it I'd take him as an additional vice a la Sergio 2 years ago.

JAS,
Phil certainly staked a claim today, playing alongside Capt.Love.

Pleased to see Hanson and Poulter out of the traps quickly, and lw1 is starting his run!

Well...like I said Kwini I'd take him. It's funny I was never Phil's greatest fan but I remember the practice rounds 2 years ago at CM. It was absolutely shedding it down. The Europeans started on the 1st, the Americans on the 10th. We were huddled under brollies on the 1st. After all the Europeans went off we were faced with either following them through the muck in the rain or waiting for the yanks (who we could see in the distance coming down the 18th). We waited...then came the announcement that the Americans wouldn't be playing any more holes. Que a little bit of crowd banter/humour/singing. The announcer shortly afterwards announced that there would be one American group continuing after all... as it turned out it was Mickleson, Fowler (his 4somes partner) and Johnson (his 4bbb partner). That was the day I completely changed my opinion of Phil and became a fan.

Weren't they the top three Americans at RStG?

Phil has quietly become a leader on their "teams", has taken one or two guys under his wing for the last three or four matches: Anthony Kim, O'Hair, Mahan, wasn't he with Watney in Melbourne?

Interesting question.

I think Ollie must be worried about his team. Luke Donald, Lee Westwood and Justin Rose look like they are completely out of form.

Aye...I think they were and I certainly think he is placing himself (whether intentionally or not) as a leader in waiting.

I don't think Olly needs to worry about late September matchplay form on a windy Friday in early August....but you never know...He might have an issue come the time...but I'd be surprised.

Don't think Phils Ryder Cup record is all that good (could be totally wrong on this) as I can't remember him having a good 3 days. So as his form is not that good, this year, would it not be better to bring some of the younger ones and break them in, to Ryder Cup golf

oldpar: Phil will play, no question. Remember, his recent role has been to break in those "younger ones".


One person we're forgetting about for the Europeans is Martin Laird, in with an afternoon 74, and in 19th place and rising. I've a feeling Medinah would suit him well.

kwinigolfer wrote:oldpar: Phil will play, no question. Remember, his recent role has been to break in those "younger ones".


One person we're forgetting about for the Europeans is Martin Laird, in with an afternoon 74, and in 19th place and rising. I've a feeling Medinah would suit him well.

I have a strong feeling Ollie will surprise us.............maybe Laird could be the man. Surely Ollie is hoping Kaymer drops out of the 10...............

"Remember, his recent role has been to break in those "younger ones"."

Surely thats tigers role?


Way easier for Love to pick as he has players in form to pick from, unlike europe who's automatic picks are not in the best of shape never mind the ones not making it at the moment.

McLaren wrote:"Remember, his recent role has been to break in those "younger ones"."

Surely thats tigers role?

I thought Tiger preferred the "cougars"

I think he was actually pretty indiscriminate if the tales are to be believed, but who doesn't like a cougar?

16 World Rankings will put Ian Poulter into the Automatin Ryder Cup positions ahead of Garcia..............is that a Top 10??

John,
A solo 7th would earn him 18 points, presume 8th is about 16.

Hopefully he'll earm many more than that.

A press report over here suggested J-M O is leaning towards Bjorn or Jimenez as his second pick, after Poulter/Garcia if that were necessary. Must admit, I'd be disinclined to pick a golfer who could have trouble going 36 holes in a day.

Bjorn does offer a lot of birdies...........a great matchplayer.
Harrington must be in the mix too............he was picked wrongly IMO 2 years ago but playing much better now...........Then again, he might win the PGA !!............Freddie Jac surely in the mix & Coelsaerts

Quite uncanny how Harrington somehow gets himself into the frame when the RC comes around. I thought his pick 2 years ago was at best dodgy but trusted Monty's judgement. If he's not in automatically this time round a pick wouldn't be quite so controversial...his star is definitely rising this year.

The worry for me is Kaymer who didn't have a great RC 2 years ago and hasn't really done much since either.

Padraig has a horrible RC record.
Can't see why folk want him picked.

Just hoping that Paul Lawrie makes it on points as I don't think Jose will pick him against the young Spaniards.

Would certainly agree that chippie should be in this time around Doon. He did well in the WGC matchplay as well which could be a factor if a pick is required....I just hope he doesn't come to regret not going to Olympic (loadsa potential points on a course that would have suited him) don't quite understand why he didn't rehash his schedule.

Why would JMO be inclined to pick "yound spainards"??

To show bias to fellow countrymen would be a disgrace...............

As for Harris "poor" RC record, i think it's unfair to describe it as poor...........certainly the last few haven't been great but in 2008 he was mentally shot after 2 majors in a row and in 2010 he was not playing well, but still got 2/4 points........................in his early RC'S he was inspirational......................

I will be so annoyed if Sergio gets picked ahead of Padraig!

I would be so annoyed if Padraig was picked ahead of Sergio !

How could anyone justify picking Sergio if he doesn't qualify automatically.

sirbenson wrote:I will be so annoyed if Sergio gets picked ahead of Padraig!

Simple, Padraig doesnt deserve a pick. Sergio aint had a good season and still had a better year than Padraig and won twice last year. There you go pick justified. Sergio also has a very good RC record unlike Padraig.

Although id pick Sergio & Colesaerts, I wouldnt be surprised if he chose Padraig & Sergio.

Sergio's good Ryder Cup record all happened six years and longer ago. He is no longer the same player and gives a very good impression of someone who doesn't even want to be on a golf course.

Tinmar wrote:Sergio's good Ryder Cup record all happened six years and longer ago. He is no longer the same player and gives a very good impression of someone who doesn't even want to be on a golf course.

And your argument for picking Harrington over him is??? Has a better record than Harrington, has had a poor season but still won twice in last year. Remind me what Harrington has done to deserve a pick??? Where is he in the world rankings? Is Harrington the same player as when he won the majors? Clearly not.

Monty and Ewan Murray said earlier its 2 from 3. Sergio, Colsaerts & Harrington. Sergio & Colsaerts for me but thats just my opinion.

I guess Bjorn and Jimenez will most likely join as vice captains.

Sand wrote:

Tinmar wrote:Sergio's good Ryder Cup record all happened six years and longer ago. He is no longer the same player and gives a very good impression of someone who doesn't even want to be on a golf course.

And your argument for picking Harrington over him is??? Has a better record than Harrington, has had a poor season but still won twice in last year. Remind me what Harrington has done to deserve a pick??? Where is he in the world rankings? Is Harrington the same player as when he won the majors? Clearly not.

Monty and Ewan Murray said earlier its 2 from 3. Sergio, Colsaerts & Harrington. Sergio & Colsaerts for me but thats just my opinion.

I never said a word about Harrington in this instance. His form has been good for the last few months but if he doesn't get picked, so be it. Sergio appears to have the worst attitude towards the game at the moment of any played I can think of. I would have his name at the bottom of a very long list.

Sand wrote:

sirbenson wrote:I will be so annoyed if Sergio gets picked ahead of Padraig!

Simple, Padraig doesnt deserve a pick. Sergio aint had a good season and still had a better year than Padraig and won twice last year. There you go pick justified. Sergio also has a very good RC record unlike Padraig.

Although id pick Sergio & Colesaerts, I wouldnt be surprised if he chose Padraig & Sergio.

I think he's got a tough choice all round, hopefully things may fall in to place in the next week or two, but I can see pros and cons for both Sergio and Padraig at this stage. But the highlighted statement is just wrong, Sergio had a far better 2011 but equally Padraig has been much the better one this year.

Given the choices, not sure I wouldn't take Sergio and Padraig.
Don't feel as if Colsaerts has done himself any favours, blowing more cold than hot, and feel as if the alternatives are back to square one:
Jimenez and Bjorn.

Would think J-M O might feel very conflicted - I know I do!

NedB-H wrote:

Sand wrote:

sirbenson wrote:I will be so annoyed if Sergio gets picked ahead of Padraig!

Simple, Padraig doesnt deserve a pick. Sergio aint had a good season and still had a better year than Padraig and won twice last year. There you go pick justified. Sergio also has a very good RC record unlike Padraig.

Although id pick Sergio & Colesaerts, I wouldnt be surprised if he chose Padraig & Sergio.

I think he's got a tough choice all round, hopefully things may fall in to place in the next week or two, but I can see pros and cons for both Sergio and Padraig at this stage. But the highlighted statement is just wrong, Sergio had a far better 2011 but equally Padraig has been much the better one this year.

Yes will admit it wasnt correct but as you can see from Prince Dracula post on the world rankings, Harrington is 43rd to Sergio's 48th on points earned this year. Hardly anything major which means he should be picked instead of Sergio. I just dont think Harrington deserves to be picked, its just my opinion but he's hardly done anything of note since his 3 majors.

I say it again and again but majors are really immaterial. If you use Majors as a caveat for picking players you end up with very weak Ryder Cup teams.

Harrington has done nothing in two years which suggests he'd be worthwhile picking.

Looks like Sergio now needs a pick.
Given his RC record and not very impressive Major record this year... is that a given?

Sergio is ranked 29, Harrington 61.
Plus Sergio has the attitude for the Ryder Cup.

I think Sergio is a must pick, but who will be his other pick, another Spaniard maybe???

Do we expect those just outside qualifying to play at gleneagles?

How can a pick be justified if they dont bother to turn up?

Sergio & Colsearts are both playing in the US event this week. Colsearts is playing at Gleneagles. Would imagine Sergio will be playing at Barclays instead of Scotland.

Dont see that being a problem as the world rankings points is the closest he is to the top 10.

super_realist wrote:
Plus Sergio had the attitude for the Ryder Cup.

I've corrected the above to give what I think is a more accurate reflection.

Have you ever heard the phrase "give a man a reputation as an early riser and that man can sleep till noon?". That would sum up Sergio and the Ryder Cup for me. He was a brilliant Ryder Cup player but that was quite some time in the past and he is a very different golfer now. Have you heard him give an interview this year? The most negative man in golf, unfortunately.

Tinmar wrote:

super_realist wrote:
Plus Sergio had the attitude for the Ryder Cup.

I've corrected the above to give what I think is a more accurate reflection.

Have you ever heard the phrase "give a man a reputation as an early riser and that man can sleep till noon?". That would sum up Sergio and the Ryder Cup for me. He was a brilliant Ryder Cup player but that was quite some time in the past and he is a very different golfer now. Have you heard him give an interview this year? The most negative man in golf, unfortunately.

Yes every interview where he is asked about the Ryder cup and he says the same every time, everyone knows what the Ryder Cup means to me.

Still has the attitude for Ryder Cup without a doubt, wont argue about him being negative as hell, his interviews largely annoy me for that very reason.

The European wild card picks are not being announced until 27 August. Despite this, it seems from the Ryder Cup website that the World points list will cut off at the conclusion in Gleneagles. In other words, the Barclays will not be included. Therefore if Poulter is not playing in the US this week, he can't add to his current total and might very well still need a pick.

Tinmar wrote:The European wild card picks are not being announced until 27 August. Despite this, it seems from the Ryder Cup website that the World points list will cut off at the conclusion in Gleneagles. In other words, the Barclays will not be included. Therefore if Poulter is not playing in the US this week, he can't add to his current total and might very well still need a pick.

Dont think thats the case this year Tinmar. Think it has been delayed until the Monday so that what happened 2 years ago doesnt happen again. Ie - Casey and Rose finding out they werent getting picked whilst they were playing in the Barclays final round.

It is correct that the Barclays does not count towards the world points list;

from the rules of qualification.

“The Ryder Cup World Points List will comprise Official World Golf Ranking Points won by a Member from each tournament in which he participates between September 1, 2011 and August 20th 2012 and thereafter in the 2012 Johnnie Walker Championship at Gleneagles ONLY.”


The Johnnie walker and Barclays both finish on the 26 Aug.

So for the world list players can play in the Wyndham Championship and gleneagles (or any other event awarded OWGR poitns up to 20th August). And for the euro list just gleneagles.

Poulter .62 of a "World" point behind Kaymer.

If Garcia achieves a top three (say) in Greensboro, or Colsaerts wins (wherever he decides to play) that .62 of a point might be crucial.
Won't affect Poulter being in the Team, but it likely WOULD affect its make up, and Olly's options.
Sod's Law suggests that fraction of a point will be important somehow.

I don't think attitude would be a problem for Sergio AT the Ryder Cup. Yes there's been a lot of negative nonsense come from him this year but that's in relation to him falling short of where he thinks he should be. He was so at odds with his game & mindset 2 years ago that he had to take a complete break. The turning point for him to me was being the additional non playing vice last time, it basically re-ignited him. I reckon there's no way Monty would have had him there if he thought he'd bring negativity.
In summary I'd say the RC Sergio is a completely different animal to the tour Sergio. If picked he'd be desparate to deliver given what happened 4 years ago and missing 2 years ago.

I could be wrong here, but could it be that all the anti-Sergio posters on this thread are Irish? Or at least Harrington supporters?

Although his form has been indifferent, Garcia brings real passion to the Ryder Cup, and unless his game totally falls apart in the next few weeks he should be guaranteed a spot. He brings much more to the team than just beautiful ball striking and dodgy putting.

raycastleunited wrote:I could be wrong here, but could it be that all the anti-Sergio posters on this thread are Irish? Or at least Harrington supporters?

Although his form has been indifferent, Garcia brings real passion to the Ryder Cup, and unless his game totally falls apart in the next few weeks he should be guaranteed a spot. He brings much more to the team than just beautiful ball striking and dodgy putting.

Well, I'm Irish and I think it might be to Padraig's benefit if he missed this Ryder Cup. His form has been very encouraging for the last few months and he just needs to validate this form by winning somewhere before the end of the year and taking a bigger jump up the rankings. I think he could have a very good Fed-Ex Cup if he didn't have to deal with all the questions about Medinah and everything that goes with it. I also think that the Ryder Cup team might benefit from having one or two rookies who would be more excited about playing than Padraig given he has already played six times.

Regarding your second paragraph about Sergio above, I would remove the present tense from everything you said and replace it with the past tense. Sergio is still only 32 so I'm not saying he's finished. He can still turn things around. However, he is a long way from that at the moment. His form is bad and his attitude on the course and in interviews is worse. Everyone you've said about what he brings to the Ryder Cup happened between 6 and 13 years ago. Anyone who thinks that he will be able to reproduce that again next month (and perhaps he will) is simply going on a gut feeling without taking any account of his form and general demeanour in recent times.

I think sergio is about th 11/12th european on the points earned in 2012 list.

McLaren wrote:I think sergio is about th 11/12th european on the points earned in 2012 list.

As with Kaymer, he earned most of his points in 2011. His form has been disimproving as the year has gone on.

Some people used all sorts of terms such as 'disgrace' and 'scandal' when Padraig was picked in 2010. If this year's system had been in place then, Padraig would have qualified automatically that year and would not have required a pick.