Ulster Rugby 2017-18

by Kingshu Wed Feb 14, 2018 4:45 pm

First topic message reminder :

I was thinkung similar McCloskey for me has been better than Arnold and Farrell and just isnt being picked. Hopefully a resurgent Ulster will make it all better

by SirBurger Tue Feb 27, 2018 3:46 pm

marty2086 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
SirBurger wrote:Not saying this to rub it in (and why would I, we are bottom of the league), but Arno Botha has been outstanding since his arrival at Irish.

He has been much better than Deysel and not so injury prone.
That was a good swap - NOT

He's played 4 games for Irish

5 games if we are being pedantic... Wink

by marty2086 Tue Feb 27, 2018 3:58 pm

SirBurger wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
SirBurger wrote:Not saying this to rub it in (and why would I, we are bottom of the league), but Arno Botha has been outstanding since his arrival at Irish.

He has been much better than Deysel and not so injury prone.
That was a good swap - NOT

He's played 4 games for Irish

5 games if we are being pedantic...

Was it not Cardiff he made his debut against?

by SirBurger Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:19 pm

marty2086 wrote:
SirBurger wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
SirBurger wrote:Not saying this to rub it in (and why would I, we are bottom of the league), but Arno Botha has been outstanding since his arrival at Irish.

He has been much better than Deysel and not so injury prone.
That was a good swap - NOT

He's played 4 games for Irish

5 games if we are being pedantic...

Was it not Cardiff he made his debut against?

No, Wasps the week before.

by marty2086 Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:20 pm

SirBurger wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
SirBurger wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
SirBurger wrote:Not saying this to rub it in (and why would I, we are bottom of the league), but Arno Botha has been outstanding since his arrival at Irish.

He has been much better than Deysel and not so injury prone.
That was a good swap - NOT

He's played 4 games for Irish

5 games if we are being pedantic...

Was it not Cardiff he made his debut against?

No, Wasps the week before.

My bad, I thought they had said Cardiff was his first game

by marty2086 Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:47 pm

Ulster Rugby is hosting an exclusive Season Ticket holder briefing with Operations Director, Bryn Cunningham, on Thursday 8th March from 7.00pm in the A&L Goodbody Lounge at Kingspan Stadium.

Bryn will present an outline of his plans for the professional team over the coming seasons, before answering questions from the floor. Fiona Hampton, Head of Sales & Marketing, will also be in attendance to respond to any commercial and PR related questions.

This is a free, ticketed event for 2017/18 Season Ticket holders. There are 250 tickets available on a first come, first served basis, and these can be accessed from your Ticketmaster Account Manager from 3pm on Tuesday 27th February.

Details on how to avail of these tickets have been emailed to all Season Ticket holders.

by toml Tue Feb 27, 2018 6:07 pm

I heard there is going to be fireworks at the games next year, and season ticket olders get a free novelty foam hand...

by neilthom7 Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:04 pm

toml wrote:I heard there is going to be fireworks at the games next year, and season ticket olders get a free novelty foam hand...

If it keeps going like this it might be petrol bombs lol

by Standulstermen Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:36 pm

Im interested to hear what Bryn has to say and i think there needs to be specifics.

by marty2086 Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:12 am

Standulstermen wrote:Im interested to hear what Bryn has to say and i think there needs to be specifics.

What worries me is that he'll just be talking about the professional game, it's the whole organisation and running of the game in Ulster that is the problem. There are insufficient numbers playing the game, there aren't enough playing the game at a young age playing into adulthood, the structures aren't right within Ulster rugby. That seems to be outside his remit but will hamper everything within his remit

by geoff999rugby Wed Feb 28, 2018 9:31 am

Go along and ask the questions then.

The rumours I am hearing is it will all be about stability going forward and fixes to the structures:
- Offer Gibbes an extended contract (so I may have got that wrong earlier)
- New CEO on the way (that wont be announced next Thursday)
- No more box office signings ala Piatau; only ones that meet the playing needs of the team
- NIQ signings will at a minimum but high quality - Hond gone this summer, Deysel next, Coetzee this summer if not fit to play
- Groundswell building that if innocent the two lads should stay - this runs counter to the committee wishes -
Could be some real internal fireworks about his. Where Cunningham and Gibbes stand (if he stays Stays) and what the two players want to do will be key in this power struggle

Bottom line is it has to be about making Ulster a rugby team better 1st, 2nd and 3rd otherwise we will implode
No more money is all important or the atmosphere or the culture and the like.
Not dismissing those things but get the rugby right has to be the single minded aim
Should add Gibbes now he is in charge reckons there is an absolute mountain to climb before this team are up to standard.
He was shocked how poor professionally we were when he arrived

by marty2086 Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:23 am

Only for ST holders and only 250 tickets available so anyone wants to help a non ST holder out with one Hug

by geoff999rugby Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:25 am

Good point I suspect they will be taken up pretty quickly - there is a lot of interest in this.
There is a school of thought Cunningham is being thrown under a bus - then again he has questions to answer himself.
The non appearance of our CEO only confirms he is on the way out - 'that damned illusive pimpernel'

by toml Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:48 am

Yeah it might be the replacement for the CEO announcement.

by geoff999rugby Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:58 am

That would be a biggy - as typically these events have not been that open.

Then again we are in strange times where bold drastic moves are required

The survey really spooked them - over 50% said they would not renew or were undecided.
They have also said prices saying the same but worried if we are in the Challenge Cup next year.
That is unacceptable to many - myself included.
Second rate completion where most teams don't take it seriously - that should be a £50 reduction in my book.

by marty2086 Wed Feb 28, 2018 11:02 am

I wonder if the current issues have anything to do with the accounts being redacted from the annual report.

by Pete330v2 Wed Feb 28, 2018 11:23 am

The way things are going there'll be more ST drivers than ST holders in the reduced crowds next season.

What's the odds that the two lads in the dock will ever want to show their faces at Ravespan again? I'd heard they were looking for contracts in Japan through a friend and through another that PJ told him that he was off no matter what the outcome. That might end the debate within Ulster Rugby itself.

by Standulstermen Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:34 pm

No harm but Jackson and Olding are the least of my issues with the setup. Theres a groundswell of support on UAFC i see but thats whom i expected to back them. Theres a lot more who would be uncomfortable with them, myself included. I suspect the IRFU would rule the roost on any decision on these guys though. If we were so poor professionally you have to wonder how anyone is going to stay in their jobs including Bryn.

There needs to be a few stellar NIQs is the sad truth (they also need to be in key positions).

Marty i have two spots reserved but in the instance i cant go i will let you know

by marty2086 Wed Feb 28, 2018 12:54 pm

Standulstermen wrote:No harm but Jackson and Olding are the least of my issues with the setup. Theres a groundswell of support on UAFC i see but thats whom i expected to back them. Theres a lot more who would be uncomfortable with them, myself included. I suspect the IRFU would rule the roost on any decision on these guys though. If we were so poor professionally you have to wonder how anyone is going to stay in their jobs including Bryn.

There needs to be a few stellar NIQs is the sad truth (they also need to be in key positions).

Marty i have two spots reserved but in the instance i cant go i will let you know

Appreciate that Stand

If they are found not guilty why would you be uncomfortable?

by Standulstermen Wed Feb 28, 2018 1:07 pm

I just think in any organisation the way the spoke about women is unacceptable. I appreciate it was never intended for public consumption and that they aren't alone in writing crude things but how do you tell your daughter that the talisman of the team she supports talks about her gender in this fashion etc.

I can see both sides and i am only slightly open to them returning because i think (from what ive heard) this should never have been brought to trial. the evidence just doesn't seem to be there.

by marty2086 Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:25 pm

I agree on almost all of that Stand but I do think it's a stretch to say they were talking about a whole gender, the messages I've seen from Olding and Jackson. are unpleasant but were about one individual and the group of them seem to be full of Poopie and insecure little boys

Hopefully some lessons taken from it

by clivemcl Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:33 pm

Frank Greaney covering the texts in court today.

They also have some unkind words about the other girls at the party.
Their texts also seem to dispute their accounts of what took place. So... they either were boasting and exaggerating like silly young lads, or...
Why am I typing.
Here's the guy who is giving the minute by minute trial.
You can get very close to the full trial by following him.

I mention this not to discuss their guilt, but as a response to the question if Ulster Rugby can live with their characters. Now that these messages are all public domain. (The fact it maybe shouldn't be doesn't change the fact that it is)

https://twitter.com/FrankGreaney

by Standulstermen Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:33 pm

definitely marty. reading today there are other bad ones albeit not sure if they are from Jackson and olding. Its difficult to say they should come back. I doubt they will

by marty2086 Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:39 pm

They probably won't but I wouldn't rely on Greaney, he seems to have forgot to include some information in his reporting that is favourable to the defendants

by Standulstermen Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:43 pm

Oh i dont think the whatsapps do anything to suggest guilt but i just dont think sponsors will like it. If it were my business they wouldn't be back

by clivemcl Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:46 pm

marty2086 wrote:They probably won't but I wouldn't rely on Greaney, he seems to have forgot to include some information in his reporting that is favourable to the defendants

Anyone else doing similar Marty that I could follow? I found it interesting how much of Greaney's commentary doesn't make it to BBC news article every day.

The thing is, with cases like this, and most high profile cases, regular folks don't really trust juries. We all want to make our own mind up don't we.

Or maybe it's just me - I'm a massive fan of shows like Making A Murderer, and podcasts like Serial, Beyond Reasonable Doubt and Black Hands.
The question of guilt and evidence intrigues me. I doubt I'm THAT odd, as these shows are all hugely popular.

But when it's closer to home, people tend to look down on anyone treating it as anything less than horrid and serious.

Take Howell for example, I have a few connections to that whole mess. And for me, I felt the media frenzy and almost entertainment was disgusting.
But being honest, if Netflix made a show about the same thing and it was based in America, I'd probably be all over it.

by marty2086 Wed Feb 28, 2018 2:53 pm

I don't clive, I just check Greaney out when I see certain things reported and to get a bit more insight but saw the Irish News reporting a few other things

by **BigGee** Wed Feb 28, 2018 3:52 pm

As a little aside from other goings on, what do you guys reckon the chance of the Glasgow match taking place this Friday night. The weather seems appalling atm and Glasgow might even struggle to get over there. There might be a better weather window by Saturday, would they move it back a day?

I guess both teams have a few free weekends in April if they want to re-schedule it.

by marty2086 Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:02 pm

BigGee wrote:As a little aside from other goings on, what do you guys reckon the chance of the Glasgow match taking place this Friday night. The weather seems appalling atm and Glasgow might even struggle to get over there. There might be a better weather window by Saturday, would they move it back a day?

I guess both teams have a few free weekends in April if they want to re-schedule it.

Pitch has covers on and the ferries are still on so shouldn't be a problem for Glasgow to make it

by Standulstermen Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:03 pm

Im not expecting it to be on wit Ulsters track record. Be delighted if it was

by marty2086 Wed Feb 28, 2018 4:20 pm

And with that the league have announced it's postponed because the conditions around game time are expected to be too hazardous for fans to travel in, lucky them I've to drive to work for 6pm Shocked

by carpet baboon Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:23 pm

Will the minutes be released after the meeting, or a video? Or does someone want to take notes for me?

by marty2086 Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:43 am

Season Tickets for 2018/19 are now on sale at ulsterrugby.com/seasontickets.

Changes for 2018/19 season

Following a consultation with current Season Ticket holders, there are a number of key changes for 2018/19.

These include a freeze on 2017/18 prices (with an option to purchase for two years at the current price), the introduction of a young adult Season Ticket for those aged 24 years and under, an increased number of exclusive events and offers, plus more flexible payment plans.

What's included in a 2018/19 Season Ticket?

- Entry to the pre-season fixture in August
- Entry to all Guinness PRO14 home games (minimum of 10), excluding play-offs
- Entry to all three home European pool matches
- One additional complimentary ticket for a PRO14 game of your choice (excluding inter-pros)

Renewals

Current Season Ticket holders can avail of a loyalty price by renewing before 30th April 2018. Prices start at £92 for children, £185 for adults and £499 for families.

Season Ticket holders who renew within the loyalty period will be automatically entered into a competition to win one of ten 2018/19 European Jerseys, while 100 supporters will have the chance to win a signed Tommy Bowe print.

You will also have exclusive access to events, such as a briefing with Operations Director Bryn Cunningham and the launch of our European jersey.

New buyers

Season Tickets for first-time buyers are now available in some areas of the stadium, with prices starting at £110 for children, £216 adults and £587 for families.

by **rodders** Thu Mar 01, 2018 10:52 am

marty2086 wrote:I agree on almost all of that Stand but I do think it's a stretch to say they were talking about a whole gender, the messages I've seen from Olding and Jackson. are unpleasant but were about one individual and the group of them seem to be full of Poopie and insecure little boys

Hopefully some lessons taken from it

Sorry but no they aren't little boys, they are grown men, professional sports people and role models.

I don't think players need to be saints and are entitled to private lives but going out, getting smashed, having threesomes, foursomes and then boasting about it on whats sap like teenagers is taking things a bit far.

The fact that Ulster are even contemplating them staying, irrespective of the trial verdict shows how detached from reality the organization have become.

by marty2086 Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:03 am

rodders wrote:
marty2086 wrote:I agree on almost all of that Stand but I do think it's a stretch to say they were talking about a whole gender, the messages I've seen from Olding and Jackson. are unpleasant but were about one individual and the group of them seem to be full of Poopie and insecure little boys

Hopefully some lessons taken from it

Sorry but no they aren't little boys, they are grown men, professional sports people and role models.

I don't think players need to be saints and are entitled to private lives but going out, getting smashed, having threesomes, foursomes and then boasting about it on whats sap like teenagers is taking things a bit far.

The fact that Ulster are even contemplating them staying, irrespective of the trial verdict shows how detached from reality the organization have become.

rodders their mentality is that of insecure little boys, the messages from McIlroy show how sad he is and clearly riding his mates coattails hoping to pick up their rejects but boasting about things that didn't happen.

Someone is a role model if you make them so. If they are found not guilty their behaviour may be unpleasant but not a patch of some of the behaviour Ulster has buried over the last decade

by Standulstermen Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:09 am

Fwiw rodders i dont believe Ulster are actually contemplating it. I've heard it 2nd hand from two different places and while i dont claim to be 'in the know' so to speak or have inside info a la Geoff i dont see why those that told me would make it up

by carpet baboon Thu Mar 01, 2018 12:00 pm

Back to a bit of rugby there is an interesting interview with Angus Curtis on ton the 42.ie. his standout performance has been at 12 for the u20s do we know if Ulster will continue this?
Also we have signed his little brother Graham a promising sh

by geoff999rugby Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:00 pm

Standulstermen wrote:Fwiw rodders i dont believe Ulster are actually contemplating it. I've heard it 2nd hand from two different places and while i dont claim to be 'in the know' so to speak or have inside info a la Geoff i dont see why those that told me would make it up

That is my understanding. The club do not intend to retain them.
However there does seem to be a groundswell of opinion, in some quarters of the supporters that if found innocent they should be allowed to play again no problem.
I am glad those text messages are out in the open now, they are, in large part, why I would prefer it if they never play again.
Fortunately it is my understanding the players want away anyway - so contracts cancelled by mutual consent is my guess.

by geoff999rugby Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:02 pm

marty2086 wrote:. If they are found not guilty their behaviour may be unpleasant but not a patch of some of the behaviour Ulster has buried over the last decade

Got to call you out on this.

What behaviour are you talking about.
I can think of one incident over a decade ago which, sadly, is comparable.
However nothing to equate to this - to be honest I believe you have just posted a unsustainable lie

by geoff999rugby Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:06 pm

carpet baboon wrote:Back to a bit of rugby there is an interesting interview with Angus Curtis on ton the 42.ie. his standout performance has been at 12 for the u20s do we know if Ulster will continue this?
Also we have signed his little brother Graham a promising sh

Might as well

Tried him at 9 and decided he is not good enough
Tried him on the wing and decided he wasn't good enough
Doesn't matter he will be 26 this year; if we try him in enough positions we will find his prefect numbered shirt by time he is 33
No offence to the guy but we have too many players in the squad who are simply not going to make it - why ?

by marty2086 Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:11 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:
marty2086 wrote:. If they are found not guilty their behaviour may be unpleasant but not a patch of some of the behaviour Ulster has buried over the last decade

Got to call you out on this.

What behaviour are you talking about.
I can think of one incident over a decade ago which, sadly, is comparable.
However nothing to equate to this - to be honest I believe you have just posted a unsustainable lie

I did say if they are found innocent, the Anscombe incident would be one and I know of one player who had a number of run ins with bouncers in Belfast including biting one, which is what I had in mind, I may be wrong to say Ulster buried that but I know someone had a word and things were dropped but the person had a reputation around Belfast of being a nightmare when they had a few drinks

by geoff999rugby Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:12 pm

I note with interest a couple of people on the other site have posted that it is their understanding Cunningham, up to now has not been responsible for deciding who to sign but to simply carry out the contract negotiations

As I have posted here he was not responsible for either Deysel or Piatau and I have not found anyone admitting to signing VdM.
So what they say does chime , a bit, to my understanding.
Since the 2015 World Cup till a couple of weeks ago it is my firm belief Kiss has been calling the shots.

Going forward Cunningham will be active in deciding player recruitment.
Gibbes, if he stays, or his replacement, will have a mountain to climb and will need all the help he can get.

Whilst Gibbes position needs to be clarified what is clear is Cunningham is going to emerge a far more powerful figures, not
least because there will be a new CEO as well.

Fingers crossed the penny has dropped and a complete overhaul of Ulster rugby is required

by marty2086 Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:12 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:
carpet baboon wrote:Back to a bit of rugby there is an interesting interview with Angus Curtis on ton the 42.ie. his standout performance has been at 12 for the u20s do we know if Ulster will continue this?
Also we have signed his little brother Graham a promising sh
Might as well

Tried him at 9 and decided he is not good enough
Tried him on the wing and decided he wasn't good enough
Doesn't matter he will be 26 this year; if we try him in enough positions we will find his prefect numbered shirt by time he is 33
No offence to the guy but we have too many players in the squad who are simply not going to make it - why ?

Curtis is only 19 Geoff

by geoff999rugby Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:18 pm

marty2086 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
marty2086 wrote:. If they are found not guilty their behaviour may be unpleasant but not a patch of some of the behaviour Ulster has buried over the last decade

Got to call you out on this.

What behaviour are you talking about.
I can think of one incident over a decade ago which, sadly, is comparable.
However nothing to equate to this - to be honest I believe you have just posted a unsustainable lie

I did say if they are found innocent, the Anscombe incident would be one and I know of one player who had a number of run ins with bouncers in Belfast including biting one, which is what I had in mind, I may be wrong to say Ulster buried that but I know someone had a word and things were dropped but the person had a reputation around Belfast of being a nightmare when they had a few drinks

The question of guilt or innocence is necessary in law to reach a black/white decision.
In reality we are in a very grey area with respect to how they have conducted themselves
What is clear to me, from those text, is their conduct is totally out of order even if, as is likely, they are found innocent.

Anscombe was out of order with his drinking but on a par with this - not in my book
Biting a bouncer or indeed pissing in a taxi - again not in my book
Not even drink driving which is a totally despicable act of irresponsibilty
None of those incidence went to court so if that is your criteria how are they, even remotely, worse ?

by geoff999rugby Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:21 pm

marty2086 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
carpet baboon wrote:Back to a bit of rugby there is an interesting interview with Angus Curtis on ton the 42.ie. his standout performance has been at 12 for the u20s do we know if Ulster will continue this?
Also we have signed his little brother Graham a promising sh
Might as well

Tried him at 9 and decided he is not good enough
Tried him on the wing and decided he wasn't good enough
Doesn't matter he will be 26 this year; if we try him in enough positions we will find his prefect numbered shirt by time he is 33
No offence to the guy but we have too many players in the squad who are simply not going to make it - why ?

Curtis is only 19 Geoff

Mea Culpa - read Cairns (who has also played at 12 this year, for the Academy) not Curtis Doh

Still concerned that we are messing about a promising 10 but not quite so bad

by marty2086 Thu Mar 01, 2018 3:48 pm

geoff999rugby wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
marty2086 wrote:. If they are found not guilty their behaviour may be unpleasant but not a patch of some of the behaviour Ulster has buried over the last decade

Got to call you out on this.

What behaviour are you talking about.
I can think of one incident over a decade ago which, sadly, is comparable.
However nothing to equate to this - to be honest I believe you have just posted a unsustainable lie

I did say if they are found innocent, the Anscombe incident would be one and I know of one player who had a number of run ins with bouncers in Belfast including biting one, which is what I had in mind, I may be wrong to say Ulster buried that but I know someone had a word and things were dropped but the person had a reputation around Belfast of being a nightmare when they had a few drinks

The question of guilt or innocence is necessary in law to reach a black/white decision.
In reality we are in a very grey area with respect to how they have conducted themselves
What is clear to me, from those text, is their conduct is totally out of order even if, as is likely, they are found innocent.

Anscombe was out of order with his drinking but on a par with this - not in my book
Biting a bouncer or indeed pissing in a taxi - again not in my book
Not even drink driving which is a totally despicable act of irresponsibilty
None of those incidence went to court so if that is your criteria how are they, even remotely, worse ?

The story I was told about Cutters Wharf sounded like laws were broken
The text messages from the two players aren't that bad in my eyes, not nice but not a sackable offence though it seems like it won't matter anyway.
Assault and other broken laws are a lot worse than falsely bragging about conquests but that's my view and I know plenty disagree

by geoff999rugby Thu Mar 01, 2018 4:57 pm

I know laws were broken at Cutters Wharf but for me those actions were those of mindless morons
However for me to behaviour towards, and talk about, fellow human beings as if they are little more than pieces of meat is a far lower bar.

Depends on where you set what is important in life I guess.
There are laws I couldn't care less about, there are actions which are not illegal I would never do

They will agree to go and as such are not being sacked.
My understanding is they want to go

by Maine man Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:10 pm

Quick question for all ulster fans, would you want Olding and Jackson to stay on if found not guilty?

by Redman Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:24 pm

Maine man wrote:Quick question for all ulster fans, would you want Olding and Jackson to stay on if found not guilty?

Under no circumstances would I want them back.

On the comparable question. There's been nothing close to this and we had some fairly obvious cocaine problems back in the day .... though that's probably longer than 10 years now.

by Standulstermen Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:43 pm

No Maine. I dont think they can come back. And its a shame because the more im reading about this i have to wonder has this prosecution actually achieved its end in their being sacked/released/careers being put in jeopardy. From the case put forward it should never have made it to court.

by clivemcl Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:51 pm

If, and it’s a very important ‘if’ it became blatantly obvious they themselves were victims of false accounts, I’d have to admit to feeling some sympathy. But even if found innocent, that doesn’t mean the girl made it up. It just means there wasn’t the evidence.
The fact of the matter remains, regardless of the incident, those texts are public domain. That can’t be undone.
If my son were a fair bit older and asked why Jackson wasn’t coming back, I’d use both those boys as perfect examples of dishonourable men who don’t respect women.
It’s nit even that I wouldn’t want them to be role models. The polar opposite. I’d use them as a picture of the very worst. A warning even.

Geoff is right.

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