England's third choice fly half

First topic message reminder :

With England likely to take Owen Farrell and George Ford (if both remain fit) on their tour to New Zealand, there is one fly half spot in the squad which is vacant.

The three obvious candidates for selection are Danny Cipriani, Freddie Burns and Stephen Myler.

Danny Cipriani - 26

Once hailed as the future of English rugby and the heir to Wilkinsons throne as England's number 10. However, a horrific ankle injury, loss of form, celebrity stardom and personal issues led to Cipriani delaying what many believe to be his destiny. His recent performances have been of a very high standard, he has been winning game for Sale, playing with structure, flair and intent. His goal kicking and tactical kicking have become more consistent and his defence has also improved considerably. He has seven caps for England.

Freddie Burns - 23

The arrogant young fly half is currently being cast aside by his club Gloucester, who he joined after betraying his home town club of Bath, Gloucester offered more money and Fred was never the most loyal of people. He's joining Leicester at the end of the season where he will fight it out with Owen Williams for the number 10 jersey. There is no doubting his ability, but he is very much a form player. His passing, running and kicking can all be highly effective, however his defence is considerably weak. He has three caps for England.

Stephen Myler - 29

Many people describe Myler as a solid club player, yet not quite cut out for international stardom. This season he has played at a consistently high standard for Northampton. He's currently out injured and his presence is being dearly missed by the Saints. He makes the back line click, keeps the scoreline ticking over and puts his body on the line in defence. He won his first and only cap last summer in Argentina and has been on the fringes of the England squad for a number of years.

People mature at different rates and ages....

Wasnt Andy Farrell captain of the GB side at 21?

GeordieFalcon wrote:People mature at different rates and ages....

Wasnt Andy Farrell captain of the GB side at 21?

He was. Of course he had been a father for 5 years by then!!!

Absolutely LT!!

And of course anyone calling son Owen a bastard........


...........


Is not wrong.

LondonTiger wrote:And of course anyone calling son Owen a bastard........


...........


Is not wrong.

Yeah but hes our bastard...

lostinwales wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:And of course anyone calling son Owen a bastard........


...........


Is not wrong.

Yeah but hes our bastard...

Well technically he is his Ma n Pas little bastard.


BTW if parents later marry is bastard status rescinded?

LondonTiger wrote:

lostinwales wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:And of course anyone calling son Owen a bastard........


...........


Is not wrong.

Yeah but hes our bastard...

Well technically he is his Ma n Pas little bastard.


BTW if parents later marry is bastard status rescinded?

Well when I think of my own kids it just depends on how well they are behaving at the time   

PS

Apparently Owens's surname for the first 5 years of his life was O'Loughlin. Does this Irish element to him explain his temper?

LondonTiger wrote:PS

Apparently Owens's surname for the first 5 years of his life was O'Loughlin. Does this Irish element to him explain his temper?

Maybe - just dont get into an internet forum based argument with him....

Getting destroyed by the AB's if he needs to come on in a game will not do Burns any good. His confidence appears to be very low already.

Take Cips, it will show if he has become a man, or is still the petulant child of old. If the latter and he gets destroyed, we have lost nothing in the future.

Jimpy wrote:

Poorfour wrote:

Jimpy wrote:

Poorfour wrote:Hartley's anger has cost England far less than Youngs' arrows this season.

Really? Hartley is a random penalty generator, even though he's better than he was, you just know it's a matter of time before reverts to type. Youngs's throwing hasn't been good, but, he carries well and doesn't appear to exhibit the need to assault opposition players, swear at the referee or bite anyone with in range (allegedly).

Hartley's most visible recent misdemeanour in an England shirt was the string of three penalties against Wales. One of them was for catching a ball in an offside position. Another one was for being jumped into by Toby Faletau; the alternative would have been to wave him through and watch him jog to the tryline. Let's leave out the disputed bite, because there's no hard evidence that it happened .

Youngs's throwing, on the other hand, cost England an attacking position in the opponents' 22 against both NZ and France, in each case directly contributing to the decisive try by the opposition.

Hartley does still have a temper, but it seems to manifest more at club level than for England (possibly because he knows he'd be out on his ear if it happens again under Lancaster). But the recent evidence is that it's not costing England victories.

I never said it had.... RTFQ.

No, but I did, and I was supporting my original point with some actual evidence in response to your unsupported assertion that Hartley is a penalty machine. And I did it without being offensive.

LondonTiger - if you read my previous posts on Youngs, I've consistently said that I think his throwing is fine when he's a starter but that he lacks the experience to come on as a replacement (when his last practice throw would have been over an hour previously) and hit his mark immediately. Lawes may have been at fault for one in Paris, but Youngs has missed more than one throw in his last few games - against NZ for example. I'd be happy to see Youngs start, but I am not at present comfortable seeing him expected to close out the game from the bench.

If cips does go on tour I just hope that the media stays off his back and let's him keep a low profile.If given an opportunity I think he will prove he has matured as a player and a man,he desperately wants to be back in the fold which can only be a good thing.