Pro12 Playoff 1; Ulster (1st) vs Scarlets (4th) at Ravenhill

First topic message reminder :

Got my ticket booked for this one- expecting a good game if the weather holds up! Scarlets will probably raise their game from their abject home display against Treviso. Having watched them this season, I have noticed that when things don't go well for them and they start making mistakes they tend to get frustrated and make more and more. It seems they once again succumbed to this malaise against an excellent Treviso side who are slowly and surely growing into a team that can contend for a Top Six placing. But at Ravenhill, there is little pressure on them and they have everything to gain and nothing to lose. Totally different scenario.

Ulster were pretty poor for the first 40 minutes against Cardiff, no denying it, and will need an improved 80 minute display to see of the challenge of Scarlets and hopefully, in the event of a win, get primed to peak in the final two weeks later. Paddy Jackson has to return to the team at 10- a better defensive organiser and tackler, a more creative outhalf and it sees Pienaar return to his best position. Diack has to play too. Diack adds a great deal of balance to our backrow and I think dropping him to accommodate both Henderson and Williams would be a big mistake. Too unbalanced. Tuohy and Muller is a better balanced second row too, especially at lineout time, and Henderson hasn't been as impressive at lock as he has at 6. It seems like Henderson and Gilroy might both miss out- Gilroy maybe even not making the bench if Fridays selection is anything to go by, although I'd like to see him in there. Peter Nelson would be unfortunate to lose his place on the bench. In terms of impact subs, I actually think Tom Court can be a good impact sub coming on at loosehead. With Court, Henderson and Gilroy leading the charge from the bench in the second half hopefully we have enough to make it to our first ever Pro12 final.

Preferred Team;

1) Callum Black
2) Rory Best
3) John Afoa
4) Johann Muller (c)
5) Dan Tuohy
6) Robbie Diack
7) Chris Henry
8) Nick Williams
9) Ruan Pienaar
10) Paddy Jackson
11) Tommy Bowe
12) Stuart Olding
13) Darren Cave
14) Andrew Trimble
15) Jared Payne

16) Rob Herring 17) Tom Court 18) Declan Fitzpatrick 19) Iain Henderson 20) Sean Doyle 21) Paul Marshall 22) Michael Allen 23) Craig Gilroy

SecretFly wrote:

So yeah,bad ref days certainly and we'll call it if we see it....but the 'bias' line remains a favourite with our Welsh kin.

I dont agree. Many of my fellow Munster fans are convinced that Poite is out to get us due to hating O'Connell.

red_stag wrote:Exactly at least dont put referees in a position where they can be easily accused of bias.

So you'd be against the idea of Owens reffing the recent Leinster V Ospreys game because he's naturally compromised in the eyes of some generalised fanbase, Stag? I wouldn't...and even had Leinster lost, I guarantee you I'd say the same thing.

That would require some co-operation between the three leagues Stag, and although I know there are cross-overs in the regular season I am not sure that the English and French would go for it. For an English ref getting the AP final is like the holy grail, I don't think giving them the Rabo or Top 14 one would be the same.

Also it is a Rabo problem, so not sure why the other leagues would get involved.

red_stag wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

So yeah,bad ref days certainly and we'll call it if we see it....but the 'bias' line remains a favourite with our Welsh kin.

I dont agree. Many of my fellow Munster fans are convinced that Poite is out to get us due to hating O'Connell.

So add Munster fans to the list then...won't stop me keeping certain Welsh fans (some of them not all of them) on it

Ah I get it, the Irish don't bemoan ref's, or make accusations...

That is squarely a Welsh trait, glad fly and Mrs P put my dirty little Welsh scumbag arse straight, thanks guys

I have not been anywhere near your....

And I didn't accuse any nationality of anything, did I?

MrsP wrote:Or maybe, just maybe, rugby fans could show a bit of respect and stop accusing refs of bias?

Certainly refs will make mistakes.

Fans will always notice the mistakes "against" their team more than the mistakes which benefit their team.

Sensible fans acknowledge that this happens and realise it is them who is biased, not the ref!

Your claiming numerous posters of being disrespecfull and non sensible, because they are voicing an opinion different to yours... After all people were slated for accusing Williams of faking a blood replacement too

Bluesman. Both Scarlets and Glasgow fans have done this after the two games. Its not edifying and neutrals can see where its unjustified whinging

Bluesman,

To be fair if you listen to some on these boards every elite referee is a cheat.

I am a neutral, and I wouldn't say any whinging was unjustified, I havn't seen the whole Glasgow game yet but the Scarlets were very unlucky with numerous key decisions.

I have at no point claimed bias, but mentioned how unfair it is to put the refs in these positions constantly, when there is no need to do so.

I'm not sure what Bloodgate has to do with this at all Blues?

I am saying that it is unsportsman like to accuse any ref of bias.

That is my opinion and you are of course very welcome to disagree. I haven't accused any Nation's fans. It was you who made the leap from my description to Welsh. I did point out that some Scarlet fans are equally happy to complain bitterly about the ref no matter what his nationality.

red_stag wrote:Bluesman,

To be fair if you listen to some on these boards every elite referee is a cheat.

well thats what happens when ref's who are just following directives inadvertantly have the power to decide the winner of most games.

MrsP wrote:

I'm not sure what Bloodgate has to do with this at all Blues?

I am saying that it is unsportsman like to accuse any ref of bias.

That is my opinion and you are of course very welcome to disagree. I haven't accused any Nation's fans. It was you who made the leap from my description to Welsh. I did point out that some Scarlet fans are equally happy to complain bitterly about the ref no matter what his nationality.

Well there was criticism who accused Williams and co of bloodgate 'thats not rugby' 'bringing the game into disrepute' etc were all used to condemn any criticism... until it was proved correct!

The point is I have accused noone of being bias, but it might happen one day, and the less the refs are put in a position to be accused the better for them it will be

Afternoon pardners, how'all doing down at the ranch....

Its a cold wet and murky Sunday so lets all shine a warm light on each other to set a balance in the world!!. Scarlets getting to the playoffs for a first time has got to be a positive, Ulster finishing on top of the Rabbo deserved to be in the final, Glasgow shaded it last night but couldn't convert pressure to points and Leinster once again revealed their class and consistency.

Lo and behold a great final to look forward to, and a lot of these players will be representing us on a united front in a few weeks time.

So big hug and Bluesman I am sending you Andrex 9 Roll Aloe Vera Skin Kind 160 Sheets so your derriere will be clean and soft ready for the Lions viewing. MrsP can you inspect to see its all pucker!!

Peace and Goodwill

thebluesmancometh wrote:

red_stag wrote:Bluesman,

To be fair if you listen to some on these boards every elite referee is a cheat.

well thats what happens when ref's who are just following directives inadvertantly have the power to decide the winner of most games.

But is that not the same of any sport. You appoint someone who isnt affiliated to either team to govern the rules.

If people are convinced all of them are cheating a system of refereeing cannot exist.

red_stag wrote:

thebluesmancometh wrote:

red_stag wrote:Bluesman,

To be fair if you listen to some on these boards every elite referee is a cheat.

well thats what happens when ref's who are just following directives inadvertantly have the power to decide the winner of most games.

But is that not the same of any sport. You appoint someone who isnt affiliated to either team to govern the rules.

If people are convinced all of them are cheating a system of refereeing cannot exist.

But that doesn't happen, Owens is friends with a number of welsh internationals, Ospreys and Scarlets players, how is he not affiliated with the Ospreys?

At the RWC Samoa were beating SA away from dumping them or Wales out at the group stage and a number of decisions went against Samoa, who then called Owens a cheat. He should never have reffed that game!!!

It's got to a point where we NEED neutral refs, either from other compatitions or at least from other nations, especially in the big games!

thebluesmancometh wrote:Ah I get it, the Irish don't bemoan ref's, or make accusations...

That is squarely a Welsh trait, glad fly and Mrs P put my dirty little Welsh scumbag arse straight, thanks guys

You're not listening, bluesman. You're writing your own scripts. Bemoaning ref decisions, I already said it happens. Yes, it happens and the Irish do it too, bless their pure hearts

Accusing refs of nationalistic bias on a constant basis??? We all do it equally?
Well, we'd have to trawl through a lot of garbage over the existence of this here 606 and the old one, blues, to prove anything - but I'd be of the opinion that no, we don't all do it equally...certainly not in a Pro12 context.

fhf.



Whilst I am sure that Blues and I are both sensible enough to discuss things without falling out I am not sure I can go quite that far!!!

A virtual would be the extent of what would be appropriate given my nickname.

red_stag wrote:Bluesman,

To be fair if you listen to some on these boards every elite referee is a cheat.

One major issue with calls about refs on here, is that people post as they watch th game, or straight after. Generally emotiins, and booze, are running through them at that point making minor calls seem game changing. Which is one reason I try to avojd being online until I have had time to relax/calm down first.

In this game I still think Sanjay should have been a red card, the trip should have been a yellow card (and not lead to Bowe scoring) and Court's try shouldn't have been awarded by the tmo as it was inconclusive. That said Gareth Davies did use his boot freely at a few rucks and Lee, and maybe Owens, were off side for Court's try, so it should have been a pen try and yellow card.

Also a fair few neutrals commented on a few calls in this game. I don't think that an English ref, Frnch ref, or even SH ref would make any difference to calls of favouritism etc, as they would just be labelled as 'homers' or 'reffing against the jeering crowd'.

SecretFly wrote:

thebluesmancometh wrote:Ah I get it, the Irish don't bemoan ref's, or make accusations...

That is squarely a Welsh trait, glad fly and Mrs P put my dirty little Welsh scumbag arse straight, thanks guys

You're not listening, bluesman. You're writing your own scripts. Bemoaning ref decisions, I already said it happens. Yes, it happens and the Irish do it too, bless their pure hearts

Accusing refs of nationalistic bias on a constant basis??? We all do it equally?
Well, we'd have to trawl through a lot of garbage over the existence of this here 606 and the old one, blues, to prove anything - but I'd be of the opinion that no, we don't all do it equally...certainly not in a Pro12 context.

And I would agree, but I would also say that was for 2 large reasons...

1/ There tends to be a number of constantly posting 'welsh' WUM's on here (wether they are actually Welsh I don't know but they are all as annoying as each other)

2/ Irish teams are generally stronger, and have less frustration surrounding them. Imagine being Welsh for a minute, constantly losing games to teams of nations we beat on a regular basis, your club owner isn't talking to/hates the governing body, your governing body doesn't care about your club, your club isn't even your club, it's a newly formed super club trying to breed out the common fanbase for the next generation, you are growing further and further disinfranchised and out of love with the game you grew up with, and all the local hero's are leaving in their droves to get away from the WRU...
I'd say the Welsh just have more to whinge about than the common club fan

And another for Spidey!

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Also a fair few neutrals commented on a few calls in this game. I don't think that an English ref, Frnch ref, or even SH ref would make any difference to calls of favouritism etc, as they would just be labelled as 'homers' or 'reffing against the jeering crowd'.

Exactly - there are always reasons that can be put forward to support a reffing bias if the viewer has the propensity to be overly acute in watching what a ref gets up to as distinct from what their own players might not be doing enough of.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

red_stag wrote:Bluesman,

To be fair if you listen to some on these boards every elite referee is a cheat.

One major issue with calls about refs on here, is that people post as they watch th game, or straight after. Generally emotiins, and booze, are running through them at that point making minor calls seem game changing. Which is one reason I try to avojd being online until I have had time to relax/calm down first.

In this game I still think Sanjay should have been a red card, the trip should have been a yellow card (and not lead to Bowe scoring) and Court's try shouldn't have been awarded by the tmo as it was inconclusive. That said Gareth Davies did use his boot freely at a few rucks and Lee, and maybe Owens, were off side for Court's try, so it should have been a pen try and yellow card.

Also a fair few neutrals commented on a few calls in this game. I don't think that an English ref, Frnch ref, or even SH ref would make any difference to calls of favouritism etc, as they would just be labelled as 'homers' or 'reffing against the jeering crowd'.

Mob mentality is also key. Lots of people all blaming the ref, feeling more assured when they see others doing the same.

Did you just call me "common" Blues????

MrsP wrote:Did you just call me "common" Blues????

Are you a welsh regional supporter?

Also just want to mention, I havn't read a single comment about blaming the ref, everyone criticised the ref but applauded the better team on the night and all season

I agree that it is stupid referees reffing teams from their own nations v teams from other nations is stupid I have always thought that fo the regular season games then Italians and Scotish should be reffing such games even if they maybe are not the best referees and for the off season if it irish v scotish or italian you have owens welsh v scotish or italian an irish ref and when irish v welsh games come up im sure they could bring in a ref for those games from a nation outside the Rabo. I am not saying Rolland was bias btw here because thats absolute rubish just saying it would be better if it was that way in my opinion. Rollans just had a bad game and contrary to popular belief it was most certainly not all one way there were a number of decisions went against Ulster too. I think i have expressed all i need to on this so I think i shall just read from here on, now I am looking forward to the final bring on those leinster folks to we show them whos boss

neilthom7 wrote:I agree that it is stupid referees reffing teams from their own nations v teams from other nations is stupid I have always thought that fo the regular season games then Italians and Scotish should be reffing such games even if they maybe are not the best referees and for the off season if it irish v scotish or italian you have owens welsh v scotish or italian an irish ref and when irish v welsh games come up im sure they could bring in a ref for those games from a nation outside the Rabo. I am not saying Rolland was bias btw here because thats absolute rubish just saying it would be better if it was that way in my opinion. Rollans just had a bad game and contrary to popular belief it was most certainly not all one way there were a number of decisions went against Ulster too. I think i have expressed all i need to on this so I think i shall just read from here on, now I am looking forward to the final bring on those leinster folks to we show them whos boss

Isn't Rolland reffing the final?

Who is reffing the final, BTW?

I hope it isn't Nigel...he hates us......

thebluesmancometh wrote:

Notch wrote:I think saying a Leinsterman like Rolland is biased towards Ulster is like saying Nigel Owens is biased towards England- no love lost between old enemies.

That is the most ignorant and disrespectfull things Ive read on these boards!!?

You must be new here

That said, by your reaction I think you've rather missed my point. Can you explain why someone from our biggest historical rivals would favour us over a team he in theory has nothing for or against? Why would a Leinsterman be biased towards Ulster? Why would a Welshman be biased towards England? How does it even make sense when you stop to think about it?

Don't give me that one nation stuff. When it comes down to it, provincial allegiances trump the national interests every time.

SecretFly wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:I agree that it is stupid referees reffing teams from their own nations v teams from other nations is stupid I have always thought that fo the regular season games then Italians and Scotish should be reffing such games even if they maybe are not the best referees and for the off season if it irish v scotish or italian you have owens welsh v scotish or italian an irish ref and when irish v welsh games come up im sure they could bring in a ref for those games from a nation outside the Rabo. I am not saying Rolland was bias btw here because thats absolute rubish just saying it would be better if it was that way in my opinion. Rollans just had a bad game and contrary to popular belief it was most certainly not all one way there were a number of decisions went against Ulster too. I think i have expressed all i need to on this so I think i shall just read from here on, now I am looking forward to the final bring on those leinster folks to we show them whos boss

Isn't Rolland reffing the final?

Ok so I was going to just read from there but this is too good to respond too lol I have no idea who refs it and I don' care if it's O'Driscoll reffing we will still show them Leinster folks that we are boss

I lost any semblance of understanding what this thread was about 3 pages ago but can I just commend everyone on it being totally regardless.

Just to summarise the last 2 pages then - from what I can ascertain, Rolland is hopelessly biased towards either Frenchmen or Leinstermen, Scottish referees are suddenly light speed sh!t at refereeing although scrupulously impartial in their sh!tness, everyone is scared of Nigel Owens because everyone believes he secretly hates their team or club captain the most, the Welsh have most to complain about because Irish provincial sides are good and frequently interfere with destiny by disrespectfully beating Welsh provincial sides, everyone blames referees but pretends they don't and there still seem to be some Welsh posters who cannot come to terms with the fact that Warbuton was sent off in a tournament that happened a couple of years ago.

Let me know if I missed anything.

George Carlin wrote:I lost any semblance of understanding what this thread was about 3 pages ago but can I just commend everyone on it being totally regardless.

Just to summarise the last 2 pages then - from what I can ascertain, Rolland is hopelessly biased towards either Frenchmen or Leinstermen, Scottish referees are suddenly light speed sh!t at refereeing although scrupulously impartial in their sh!tness, everyone is scared of Nigel Owens because everyone believes he secretly hates their team or club captain the most, the Welsh have most to complain about because Irish provincial sides are good and frequently interfere with destiny by disrespectfully beating Welsh provincial sides, everyone blames referees but pretends they don't and there still seem to be some Welsh posters who cannot come to terms with the fact that Warbuton was sent off in a tournament that happened a couple of years ago.

Let me know if I missed anything.

yeah creatine dehydrates you

George Carlin wrote:I lost any semblance of understanding what this thread was about 3 pages ago but can I just commend everyone on it being totally regardless.

Just to summarise the last 2 pages then - from what I can ascertain, Rolland is hopelessly biased towards either Frenchmen or Leinstermen, Scottish referees are suddenly light speed sh!t at refereeing although scrupulously impartial in their sh!tness, everyone is scared of Nigel Owens because everyone believes he secretly hates their team or club captain the most, the Welsh have most to complain about because Irish provincial sides are good and frequently interfere with destiny by disrespectfully beating Welsh provincial sides, everyone blames referees but pretends they don't and there still seem to be some Welsh posters who cannot come to terms with the fact that Warbuton was sent justifiably off in a tournament that happened a couple of years ago.

Let me know if I missed anything.

neilthom7 wrote:

George Carlin wrote:I lost any semblance of understanding what this thread was about 3 pages ago but can I just commend everyone on it being totally regardless.

Just to summarise the last 2 pages then - from what I can ascertain, Rolland is hopelessly biased towards either Frenchmen or Leinstermen, Scottish referees are suddenly light speed sh!t at refereeing although scrupulously impartial in their sh!tness, everyone is scared of Nigel Owens because everyone believes he secretly hates their team or club captain the most, the Welsh have most to complain about because Irish provincial sides are good and frequently interfere with destiny by disrespectfully beating Welsh provincial sides, everyone blames referees but pretends they don't and there still seem to be some Welsh posters who cannot come to terms with the fact that Warbuton was sent off in a tournament that happened a couple of years ago.

Let me know if I missed anything.

yeah creatine dehydrates you

And View has great legs for high heels.

It's the Pantene he uses on them

George Carlin wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:

George Carlin wrote:I lost any semblance of understanding what this thread was about 3 pages ago but can I just commend everyone on it being totally regardless.

Just to summarise the last 2 pages then - from what I can ascertain, Rolland is hopelessly biased towards either Frenchmen or Leinstermen, Scottish referees are suddenly light speed sh!t at refereeing although scrupulously impartial in their sh!tness, everyone is scared of Nigel Owens because everyone believes he secretly hates their team or club captain the most, the Welsh have most to complain about because Irish provincial sides are good and frequently interfere with destiny by disrespectfully beating Welsh provincial sides, everyone blames referees but pretends they don't and there still seem to be some Welsh posters who cannot come to terms with the fact that Warbuton was sent off in a tournament that happened a couple of years ago.

Let me know if I missed anything.

yeah creatine dehydrates you

And View has great legs for high heels.

hey no shame in that well so i'm told

George Carlin wrote:I lost any semblance of understanding what this thread was about 3 pages ago but can I just commend everyone on it being totally regardless.

Just to summarise the last 2 pages then - from what I can ascertain, Rolland is hopelessly biased towards either Frenchmen or Leinstermen, Scottish referees are suddenly light speed sh!t at refereeing although scrupulously impartial in their sh!tness, everyone is scared of Nigel Owens because everyone believes he secretly hates their team or club captain the most, the Welsh have most to complain about because Irish provincial sides are good and frequently interfere with destiny by disrespectfully beating Welsh provincial sides, everyone blames referees but pretends they don't and there still seem to be some Welsh posters who cannot come to terms with the fact that Warbuton was sent off in a tournament that happened a couple of years ago.

Let me know if I missed anything.

Well you forgot Scotland are rubbish, and were only rescued from another 5th/6th place finish in this years 6 Nations by an injury ravaged Ireland (who they seemed to get totally outplayed by none the less).

you also forgot " everyone hates the welsh"

TJ wrote:

The Saint wrote:

Taffineastbourne wrote:

TJ wrote:Just watched the game - dunno what the whinging about the ref is about. Missed loads of offsides from the Scarlets for example - missed a subtle trailing leg perhaps - the only bad mistake.

Then you must be a top level Scottish ref coz they don't know what they are doing either!

The game thread has moved on since so don't drag it back up with your usual anti-Wales BS. There's a top lad .

What anti welsh BS. Once again a paranoid poster who cannot understand that critism of welsh players and or fans does not equal anti welsh bias.

I just hate whinging about refs and said similar on the Glasgow / Leinster thread. I am anti whinging that its all the refs fault when you got beat especially when to neutral eyes it is not. Scarlets could easily have had penalty try against and 2 yellows for the two guys who tackled from off side on the goalline. Refs mistakes work both ways - and this can be seen if you are two eyed. One eyed fans only see the decisions that go against them.

Now grow up and stop claiming you were only beaten because of the ref and that anytime anyone has an opinion you do not share it is anti wales bias. it makes you look childish and stupid

I didn't claim I was beaten by a ref, and if you had payed attention you would have noted I'm 'neutral.' Now you're the one looking stupid with little rants like that.
As for your anti-welsh comments, well I believe you had some removed on the Lions Weaknesses thread, did you not? Although if you were not anti-anything apart from anti-refwhinging in this instance then I have made a mistake.

Although I'm neutral I'm still Welsh, so naturally support the Welsh teams. In that case I would often be unintentionally looking for the decision that I feel go against my team. If I was a Glasgow fan watching this game I doubt I would notice unless it was pointed out and I might have had to go back and review it. I guess looking for ways to criticise the ref is a trait and one I should no doubt shake off.

I've watched Ulster a lot of times this season and they're not only beating teams, they're thrashing teams. They're fantastic and something the Welsh Regions need to aspire to. Their place in the final is deserved and I think this year they will take it. Hope this clears things up again, for those who think I'm ref-blaming for the Scarlets loss.

TJ wrote:you also forgot " everyone hates the welsh"

People most certainly have hated in the past two seasons if online forums are anything to go by.

TJ wrote:you also forgot " everyone hates the welsh"

Green eyed monsters

thebluesmancometh wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

thebluesmancometh wrote:

Notch wrote:I think saying a Leinsterman like Rolland is biased towards Ulster is like saying Nigel Owens is biased towards England- no love lost between old enemies.

I don't think Rolland is biased against Ulster at all btw. I have not even the slightest inclination to think that that is even close to being true. Same as I think claims of his 'bias' against the Scarlets are nonsense. But in Irish rugby, it's provincial allegiance first 90% of the time.

That is the most ignorant and disrespectfull things Ive read on these boards!!

With regards to being 'anti - welsh' Why oh why is anyone responding to the 'non welsh' saint, he is clearly here to sway opinion against Wales and I don't understand why your all falling for it?

Some of us aren't responding to what Saint says though but to other comments. You alluded to Rolland being put in an unfair position. And that had he switched positions with a linesman there wouldn't have been a 'ref' issue with the game. I asked you what issue was there?

That Rolland was an Irish ref officiating in a game with an Irish side? That was the 'unfair position' he was put in?
Nigel Owens officiated in the recent Ospreys V Leinster game. Was his an 'unfair position' to be put in?
You might say no, because he's a world class ref who proves he doesn't let bias interfere with his subjective reffing of a game. And if you said that, you might be right; but you'd also be accusing Rolland of not being so professional. And we'd be back to square one about just what Rolland is being accused of - bad reffing or biased reffing?

We won't be back at square one at all, because I think an Irish ref reffing on Irish soil for an Irish team is just as wrong as Welsh ref reffing on Welsh soil for a Welsh team!!

My points aren't directed at Rolland as an individual, it's as his nationality!! Similarly when Owens was accused of cheating at the RWC, he should never have been reffing Samoa when they were in with a shout at putting Wales out of the world cup!!!

On this occasion Rolland, the Irish ref had a stinker and numerous decisions went for the home team, if he didn't ref the game there couldn't be any issue over a Scottish ref being bias toward either team!!

I have no doubt whatsoever that if Owens had a stinker and gave the Ospreys a number of key decisions there would be uproar from the Irish (and myself) over bias and ref placement!!

Bluesman, are you referring to the SA/Samoa fixture? I don't think their chance of putting us out of the world cup was THAT realistic, our points difference was too high and at the end I think we had the highest PD in the pool.

On the subject of Owens, I think he's one of like two or three good refs in the entire world. It hasn't been a good year for officials with Joubert, Clancy and Walsh all coming in for heavy criticism. I think Joubert is one of the worst right now.

The saint - I have never made an antiwelsh statement in my life nor did I get any removed from any thread.


As for anti ref whinging - as I said I made exactly the same point on the Glasgow thread

You make my point with your claim to be welsh but neutral and your ridiculous accusations of anti welsh behaviour. Its pathetic. stop it.

That's a bit harsh Rev.

No one here is calling the Welsh any kind of a monster, no matter what colour their eyes!



What was it Gwynn Jones said on ScrumV?

Something along the lines of

"Rolland was dreadful.....when you look through it it's hard to pick too many examples of when he got things wrong but , my impression was he was just awful."

MrsP wrote:That's a bit harsh Rev.

No one here is calling the Welsh any kind of a monster, no matter what colour their eyes!



What was it Gwynn Jones said on ScrumV?

Something along the lines of

"Rolland was dreadful.....when you look through it it's hard to pick too many examples of when he got things wrong but , my impression was he was just awful."

I had a girlfriend like that once.