Wales 22 based only on form from this season.

If you had never seen or known about the reputation of the Welsh players and you had to pick a side based on form only from the first 4 competitive games this season who would get in your team?
Id go with..

1.D.Jones
2. K.Owen
3. A.Jarvis
4. B.Davies
5. A-W.Jones
6. A.Shingler
7. J.Tipuric
8. T.Faletau
9.T.Knoyle
10. D.Biggar
11. G.North
12. S.Williams
13. J.Davies
14. A.Cuthbert
15. L.Williams

16. M.Rees
17. R.Bevington
18. L.Reed
19. Warburton/Lydiate
20. L.Williams
21. R.Patchell
22. J.Roberts

Biggar? He can't organise a backline to save his life and his form has been pretty average, our attack would go to the dumps.
Priestland's playing pretty well in attack, it's just his goal kicking which is terrible.

Evans instead of Reed on the bench.

Knoyle lost it against the O's, not ready for international rugby.
Start Webb and Gareth Davies instead of Lloyd Williams on the bench.

I would start Roberts and Halfpenny (for GK) as well and have Liam Williams on the bench. With Scott out of the 22, he showed he can sometimes have tunnel vision against the O's.

The rest of the team seems pretty fair based only on form and players based in Wales.

L Williams
A Fenby
J Davies
S Williams
G North
R Patchell
R Rees

D Jones
K Owens
A Jarvis
B Davies
R Kelly
J Navidi
S Warburton
T Faletau

(bench -: R Hibbard, R Bevington, AW Jones, R Jones, G Davies, D Biggar, T Prydie)

D Jones
Owens
Jarvis
Davies
Evans
Shingler
R Jones
Tipuric

Knoyle
Patchell

North
Davies
S Williams
Cuthbert

L Williams

However not many International sides are picked purely on current form, reputation and previous performances in an International shirt comes into it.

After all we have seen before how better players perform in the Welsh set up than at their Region.

Bedford is right and frankly, bu66er from right now


what we need is big game players with expereince to handle a difficult autumn season...yes if there are some bolters then they can bench but this is not the time to blood talent and certainly not the time to give Biggar another shot!

Priestland has played well bar goal kicking, with halfpenny at 15 and hook on the bench we'd be covered.

James
Owens
Jarvis (though I'm sure Adam will be fit).
AWJ
Ian Evans
Lydiate
Warburton
Faletau
Phillips
Priestland
Cuthbert
Roberts
Davies
North
Halfpenny

Gethin
Rees
Ryan
Tipuric
Knoyle
Hook
Scott W

Duncan Jones
Matthew Rees
Aaron Jarvis
Bradley Davies
Alun Wyn Jones
Aaron Shingler
Sam Warburton
Ryan Jones

Jonothan Evans
Rhys Patchell
George North
Scott Williams
Jonathan Davies
Alex Cuthbert
Liam Williams

Ken Owens, Paul James, Toby Faletau, Ian Evans, Tavis Knoyle, Dan Biggar, Jamie Roberts.

I'd say that is spot on .

Tom Prydie is a good inclusion, you probably could have put in Dan Evans at 15 aswell. Kelly is also an excellent shout, that guy has been in great form. We're still a bit short at TH but this is a good article because it might show us some depth we didn't know we had. I would definitely like to see Patchell and Prydie called up this autumn.

I agree regarding Patchell and Prydie. Both are proving very good as us dan evans.

Agree regarding TH with Mitchell injured the back up is obviously third choice. Ospreys camp are promising good things regarding Adam jones though so not a huge worry.

FORM PLAYERS
"Cat among the pidgeon"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/19563681

Thats your form 10

"If things don't change they will stay as they are"

On a side issue......
Prydie must be involved with the Welsh setup and quickly he has looked seriously good this term, ditto with Patchell. North has looked awesome, Scott Williams has been looking sharper than Beck, Bishop has looked the form centre for the Os, Shingle must be a shoe-in at blindside. AWJ and Ian Evans are major penalty liabilities to their regional team let alone been exposed to the intensity of test level, Ryan Jones looked awesome against the Scarlets. Tarvis Knoyle has been a country mile ahead of any welsh 9 this term

15 L Williams
14 G North
11 T Prydie

13 J Davie
12 S Williams

10 D Biggar
9 T Knoyle

1.D.Jones
2. K.Owen
3. A.Jarvis
4. L Reed
5. L Charteris
6. A.Shingler
7. J.Tipuric
8. R Jones

Has Charteris been playing well? Evans and Davies are penalty machines, and for Wales have yet to show up and bully the opposition like we need them to. AWJ hasn't been as bad as you make out, maybe the world cup locks are to be reunited. Reed, Biggar and Tips have had one good game. Knoyle has been given a few chances but still shows the same weaknesses (but I'm a big fan of Gareth Davies if you didn't know). Not a bad team you have put out anyway. It seems a lot of us agree on most positions and the players who aren't far off.

Shame Jones has retired. He's been in fine form, the good long rest must have helped. Him and Wilkinson are shoe-ins for the Lions .

Cheers Morgannwg

Jones actually hasn't retired, and its funny that suddenly London Wasps are now described as an attacking team since he has been pulling the strings, no co-incidence that the Scarlets were thought of in the same vein when "the count" was in the pivotal role. But looking long term it would be a mistake to call him back for the autum or summer tests.

Re: Charteris I am not 100% certain but I was told that he has settled in well and his performances are showing that. Biggar has played well this season (whether starting or off the bench) both attacking and defensively, and his kicking was pretty damn good against the Scarlets. AWJ has the tendancy to give away pens under pressure, but you cant question his astuteness and bravery, Ian Evans IMHO hasnt done anything of note this season apart from pens in the first game, and been binned. I think Gareth Davies is very good but Knoyle has kept him out of the side this term due to his attacking and strength pretty consistent form too.

Good call tho Morgannwg

If you were picking on form, and included all Welsh players not just the one's playing in Wales, then you would have to include Hook and Brew they are playing out of their skins in France at the moment, then at fullback the best one at the moment is Dan Evans at the Dragons, also Duncan Jones is a good shout, but Paul James has being giving a good account of himself at bath. For all his critics Lloyd Williams has been playing well so I would put him in as well.

That's funny, I thought he had retired, at least from international duty. Maybe he just stepped down without announcing his retirement (like Gareth Thomas did). Is there a young 10 at Wasps? I'm sure he could pick up a lot from Jones and Robinson. As for the summer tests, I'm hoping Patchell gets a shot, I've been really impressed with his all around play. Biggar did impress me at the end of last season but it didn't take long for me to be unimpressed again, such a drop-goal merchant (and he ALWAYS misses).

LordDowlais wrote:If you were picking on form, and included all Welsh players not just the one's playing in Wales, then you would have to include Hook and Brew they are playing out of their skins in France at the moment, then at fullback the best one at the moment is Dan Evans at the Dragons, also Duncan Jones is a good shout, but Paul James has being giving a good account of himself at bath. For all his critics Lloyd Williams has been playing well so I would put him in as well.

Lets get the facts straight about Hook.... he was bloody excellent (in my mind MOM) against Toulouse last week, but the three games prior to that he has been at best average, the word from my mate is "he is doing a good job but is very conservative at the moment" , the rumour mill is that (but for his massive wage bill the coaching setup is under pressure from the owners to play him at 10), he will be shipped to outside centre with french supporters baying for their young french starlet ready to rock and roll at outside half. Brew on the other hand is having a ball in France.

Sorry FHF - you've been misinformed about Hook. He was man of the match against Bayonne and has been consistently strong at ten.

Don't take my word for it - a quote from our amusingly named French friend 'whocares' from another thread;

"yep that's right - he wasnt spectacular (he did more in previous games) but did what he had to do against a negative team such as Bayonne ie control the game and score all his penalties. patron means boss basically.

if hook was french he would be our flyhalf without a shadow of a doubt. once he had gametime and confindence, he became essential to perpignan."

Mr F (me old mucker.... how are you?)

Lets cast a line in the sand here.... 26.09.12. Your informed source v mine, lets rewind to this date in about 12 months time.

The information I believe is "pukker" as it comes from a close friend and season ticket holder down the french way. The three games prior to Toulouse saw Hook play a conservative gameplan which has not gone down well with the home fans fuelling the rumour that Hook is been forced to consider his four year stint with the "escape" contract due to HC exclusion as a possible excuse.

Lets see

who is the young french starlet?

Now you are asking something which I cant remember, suffice I have been told quite a few times over a few bottles of red but usually cannae remember my name the morning after.... never mind a young talent in a club I have no real interest in. It was in response to me bleating on about how Hooky will be a force in world rugby as a 10 now that he is settled in France, I was quite shocked to hear that that is not entirely how the Western Mail or "Agent" Derwyn Jones is reporting back to you guys

flyhalffactory wrote:Now you are asking something which I cant remember, suffice I have been told quite a few times over a few bottles of red but usually cannae remember my name the morning after.... never mind a young talent in a club I have no real interest in. It was in response to me bleating on about how Hooky will be a force in world rugby as a 10 now that he is settled in France, I was quite shocked to hear that that is not entirely how the Western Mail or "Agent" Derwyn Jones is reporting back to you guys

What club is your 'close friend' a season ticket holder at?

What's his first name?

Where do you go drinking? Over there or over here? When did he move to France?

Hmmm?

Good grief Mr F (this is the world wide web..... data protection and all that my man)

He is a surgeon and an old uni mate, married a very hot french economist who is also a mate of mine. He is a 'burgh man and now an adopted Perpignan fellar

I go drinking where ever there is an open bottle...... I was fortunate to see Hooky have a superb end of season last term. And of course Stoko now flourishing there is an added incentive to chat about our foreign friends.

....... what about you Mr F.......... want to provide the site with some personal details about your wee self?

Pot Noodle Miner wrote:If you had never seen or known about the reputation of the Welsh players and you had to pick a side based on form only from the first 4 competitive games this season who would get in your team?
Id go with..

1.D.Jones
2. K.Owen
3. A.Jarvis
4. B.Davies
5. A-W.Jones
6. A.Shingler
7. J.Tipuric
8. T.Faletau
9.T.Knoyle
10. D.Biggar


11. G.North
12. S.Williams
13. J.Davies
14. A.Cuthbert
15. L.Williams

16. M.Rees
17. R.Bevington
18. L.Reed
19. Warburton/Lydiate
20. L.Williams
21. R.Patchell
22. J.Roberts

1. Duncan Jones
2. Hibbard
3. Adam (even bit of a game was enough to highlight gulf in class and put extent of problem in context)
4. Bradley
5. Alan Wyn
6. Shingler
7. Tipuric
8. Ryan Jones

9. An Other (not really seeen a scrum half in good form. Bit of a problem)
10. Biggar
11. Fenby
12. A Beck
13. J Davies
14. George
15. L Williams

Major problem in two key positions. Adam is becoming more prone to niggly injuries as he ages and there is no cover remotely in his class. We need to start throwing some young ones in and let them sink or swim. Being a stubborn competitive bugger is also prerequisite and that is the problem with the recognised back up options. They are all a bit soft and too easily bullied. Good props will learn quick or they will continue to get hidings. Someone like Adam needs to be involved as a role model mentor and coach. A what do I do if this happens, if the loosehead does this what do I do, kind of coach. Typical modern TH are just big strong units but limited in the dark arts. Look what happened to the much lauded Vickery in the first test of the last Lions tour. He only had one technique, win the collision at engagement. Once he was unable to do that he was worse than useless, he was a liability. I know Beast was breaking the rules BOOHOO an old school tighthead would have just sorted him out as Adam did at the very first scrum.

Scrum half is hopefully merely a form issue and someone will play themselves into shape.

Other than that these are the form players. Scott Williams is playing well and has many qualities but lacks spacial awareness, a failing he has demonstrated again many times already this season. Beck's defensive concentration seems to have improved and his vision and offloading on the gain line is a added threat. Biggar (and I am not his biggest fan by a long way) is in great form and getting better each week. Against Munster he played smart heads up rugby. If he continues in this vein he should start in the autumn. His goal kicking is also first rate at the moment.

The rest pick themselves, Halfpenny will no doubt replace Williams at some point

1. Paul James
2. Richard Hibbard
3. Adam Jones
4. AWJ
5. Ian Evans
6. Ryan Jones
7. Sam Warburton (Captain)
8. Toby Faletau
9. Tavis Knoyle
10. Dan Biggar
11. Alext Cuthbert
12. Scot Williams
13. Jon Davies
14. George North
15. Liam Williams

16. Ryan Bevington
17. Matthew Rees
18. Aaron Shingler
19. Justin Tupuric
20. Rhys Webb
21. James Hook
22. Dan Evans

Missing players who should be considered wen fit Halfpenny, Lydiate, Mitchell, Patchell, Tovey, Habberfield.

We really are starting to improve our player base, the investment in youth rugby by the WRU and the Regions academies hard work on players and coaches is really paying off.

Anyone who picks Hibberd should kick themselves in the bollix

I disagree he is in fantastic form at set piece and in the loose.

mowgli wrote:Anyone who picks Hibberd should kick themselves in the bollix

Say that to the Scarlets and Munster supporters

Ospreys line out was superb last two matches. Should that continue for the next three games until the squad is announced on the 22nd then I would feel agrieved.

That may be the case but he has the decision making skills of a mosquito/Ronan o Gara

If Hibbard was flyhalf I would worry, as a hooker he does a good job. Out performing all the other welsh options at the moment.

Who would you have Mowgli and why...?

anyone but Hibberd.

He may well have learned after giving Aus the game in the summer and I hope that is the case however I think anyone whose sole contribution to a game is to hand it to the opposition shoudl be tarred, feathered and sent to Port Talbot for the rest of their lives.

Rees seems to be the in form Welsh scrum half no ?

Prydie is playing well behind a frankly poor platform.

mowgli wrote:anyone but Hibberd.

He may well have learned after giving Aus the game in the summer and I hope that is the case however I think anyone whose sole contribution to a game is to hand it to the opposition shoudl be tarred, feathered and sent to Port Talbot for the rest of their lives.

Some people would pay a lot of money for that mate...!


Anyhow forgive and forget I say. Especially when they have worked so hard on their game and are playing so well.