Freddie Roach - What do you make of him?

Personally i've gone off him quite a bit in the last 2-3 years.

I think the attention he's got over the last few years has gone to his head and resulted in a side effect of his head now positioned up his a-hole.

Lately he's spoken regarding Chavez Jr vs Alveraz and slated Alverez for demanding a catchweight and says he's against them. I know he's said before he's not keen on them but when you're star boy wins his last 2 'world titles' using catch weights which were both solely to their advantage I think he should keep his mouth firmly shut.

He's also slated Martinez lately in his attempt to protect/defend Chavez Jr not fighting him. How he has the nerve to criticise Martinez while protecting Chavez Jr is beyond me.

Roach is just embarrassing himself, he knows Martinez would destroy his fighter and if merely stalling and probably will try and go down the same route as he's taken with Pac, i.e. avoid and run until the other guy looks beatable which considering Martinez is 37 soon, he'll try and wait a year or two.

I also think he's gets a lot of sympathy because of his illness, which of course I feel sorry for him about but his comments shouldn't be ignored and are irrespective of it.

Not a horrible guy, just an irritating guy IMO. What do you think of him?

He's clearly a very good trainer, I don't think there is anyone that can argue that, as for some of the things he says, well they are sometimes contentious, but in turth he's only ever going to side with his fighters when the questions are brought to him. This usually brings hypocrisy, which then leads to criticism, all in all I think he's a nice guy, though you could be right, in regards to him possibly getting a tad big headed due to the amount of publicism he has gotten in the past few years and all of the accolades due to Manny.

I think theres good and bad with him. When hes talking about a fighter hes involved then yeah, you have to take what he says with a pinch of salt because you know theres an angle there.

But I I find him pretty straight talking in terms of analysing a fight or fighter, or giving his views in the aftermath of a fight or about fighters he is not involved with.

I dont think he is any better or worse than any other trainer who gets a mike or a camera stuck in front of him and is asked to comment about their fighter or opponent though. 99% of the time you are going to get BS in that case. Roach just gets alot more media coverage these days on account of his stable.

I like him. Good trainer, speaks a lot of truth most of the time, but as Alex says comments on his fighters should be taken with a pinch of salt - he is hardly going to turn around and say 'Martinez wants us, but we don't want him because he would hand us our backside' is he?

decent trainer, but got a bit of the old Jose Mourinho about him. get yourself in a position where you get the choice of coaching the best talent around, and then surprise surprise, they turn out to be successful, what a fantastic achievement

Fists of Fury wrote:I like him. Good trainer, speaks a lot of truth most of the time, but as Alex says comments on his fighters should be taken with a pinch of salt - he is hardly going to turn around and say 'Martinez wants us, but we don't want him because he would hand us our backside' is he?

Well to be fair he said he didn't want Manny to fight Mosely a few years back at 147 as he was too good.

my favourite trainer is Nazim Richardson, he seems to understand exactly what is best for his fighter, even when it includes protecting yourself and goin home with your money like the last mosley fight. roach has given himself the added burden of trying to come accross well to the boxing public, and sounds more like a politician when he speaks publicly these days. can see why hopkins ditched him after the calzaghe fight

Nazim Richardson* and for me I would agree Lance I like him a lot to be honest and he also seems like a good motivator.
Freddy did have a bit of luck with finding Pacqiaou but lets not forget he wasn't half the fighter he is now.

Think he's a good trainer,but anything he says whether it be about his own fighters or other fights or fighters tends to be carved in stone Freddy says it so it must be right. The gospel according to Mr Roach.

The catchweight stip on Manny's last fight wasn't particularly to Manny's advantage. Lets be real here.

yeah a catchweight will usually help the smaller fighter.

azania wrote:The catchweight stip on Manny's last fight wasn't particularly to Manny's advantage. Lets be real here.

I wasn't thinking of Manny's last fight with Marquez, more the Cotto and Margarito fights, however I don't understand how the catchweight in the Marquez fight didn't benefit him, please explain?

Asking Marquez to come up 2 divisions to where Manny naturally weighs is surely to Manny's advantage and not Marquez's?

Wouldn't a 140ibs catchweight have been the fairest solution?

Valero's Conscience wrote:

azania wrote:The catchweight stip on Manny's last fight wasn't particularly to Manny's advantage. Lets be real here.

I wasn't thinking of Manny's last fight with Marquez, more the Cotto and Margarito fights, however I don't understand how the catchweight in the Marquez fight didn't benefit him, please explain?

Asking Marquez to come up 2 divisions to where Manny naturally weighs is surely to Manny's advantage and not Marquez's?

Wouldn't a 140ibs catchweight have been the fairest solution?

That wouldnt be a catchweight. It would be dropping down a whole division.

Fair enough Manos! but a 144ibs catchweight certainly helps rather than hinders Pac surely?

Anyway this subject is boring now!

His recent comments on catchweights and Alvarez/Chavez Jr were appallingly hypocritical and really made him look silly. I used to like Roach but the more he gets involved in the super fights and all the hype that surrounds them, the more he seems to be coming out with double standards, and 'tell the truth when it suits you' Arum style comments.

Valero, Pac had been fighting at 147, so he could have asked Marquez to come up to that limit.

Agree, tis boring, though.

Valero's Conscience wrote:Fair enough Manos! but a 144ibs catchweight certainly helps rather than hinders Pac surely?

Anyway this subject is boring now!

The two guys are similarly sized so I never really felt it made much of a difference to begin with. I think it was just to make the bout appear more even in order to sell to the public. But technically as Pacquiao was fighting at WW and putting his welterweight title on the line, and marquez was coming up to challenge for it, having a catchweight would have favoured Marquez in theory - in the context of fighting for the welterweight title.

manos de piedra wrote:

Valero's Conscience wrote:Fair enough Manos! but a 144ibs catchweight certainly helps rather than hinders Pac surely?

Anyway this subject is boring now!

The two guys are similarly sized so I never really felt it made much of a difference to begin with. I think it was just to make the bout appear more even in order to sell to the public. But technically as Pacquiao was fighting at WW and putting his welterweight title on the line, and marquez was coming up to challenge for it, having a catchweight would have favoured Marquez in theory - in the context of fighting for the welterweight title.

Understand what you mean, personally i'd like to never see a catch weight ever again and if they are in place then a title can never be on the line.

Boxers weight classes have relatively minuscule differences between them so the need for catch weights is crazy to me.

Valero's Conscience wrote:

manos de piedra wrote:

Valero's Conscience wrote:Fair enough Manos! but a 144ibs catchweight certainly helps rather than hinders Pac surely?

Anyway this subject is boring now!

The two guys are similarly sized so I never really felt it made much of a difference to begin with. I think it was just to make the bout appear more even in order to sell to the public. But technically as Pacquiao was fighting at WW and putting his welterweight title on the line, and marquez was coming up to challenge for it, having a catchweight would have favoured Marquez in theory - in the context of fighting for the welterweight title.

Understand what you mean, personally i'd like to never see a catch weight ever again and if they are in place then a title can never be on the line.

Boxers weight classes have relatively minuscule differences between them so the need for catch weights is crazy to me.

I agree. I dont have any problem with catchweights in general but think its contradictory to have titles on the line for them.

Fists of Fury wrote:I like him. Good trainer, speaks a lot of truth most of the time, but as Alex says comments on his fighters should be taken with a pinch of salt - he is hardly going to turn around and say 'Martinez wants us, but we don't want him because he would hand us our backside' is he?

Well then why cant he be honest and say, we can make it happen, it would be a tough fight but its one the public wants. Instead he completely contradicts himself. I dont think many people would be bothered, but for all those people who know that Manny Pacquiao has been taking a free ride against drained opposition, then its VERY annoying. I mean, Pacquaio fought Maragrito for the Light Middle title at 154lbs, but made him come in a t 151lbs!!?? Manny or Marg were not even mandatory challengers so how the hell did that happen? Especially for the WBC belt!! Then he fights for Cotto WW title (147lbs) and makes THE CHAMPION come in at 145lbs?! How the hell does this happen? I dont get it and it frustrates me. After the fight last weekend against Marquez i seriously considered not ever watching boxing again. Its becoming a complete joke of a sport. If things like this keep happening, then people will leave. Its like Hopkins fighting Wladamir at a catchweight of 185lbs for the WBC HW title. NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN. But Pacman......well he gets that accolade and become an 8 weight world champ. Do one. Bob Arum.

i like watching the fights so wouldnt consider stopping watching boxing.

Yeh but nowadays you pretty much can bet on any fight. Pacman vs Marquez, my money was on Pac no matter what. Even if Pacman got KTFO he would have won. Its like Klitshcko vs Mormeck. Come on. KLITSCHKO KO. Its like Pacman vs Marquez 4 (joke fight), or its bet you any money pacman fights someone like Bradley in his next fight. Its pants. Basically people should come out and say, "right, Pacquiao, you won the WBC title at 154lbs, now defend it before you relinquish it. Martinez is coming down in weight to meet you at 154lbs, no catchweights." CAN YOU IMAGINE THE PACMAN CAMP if that happened?!?!? There would be uproar. Im just SICK of these decsions. I watched Alexander vs Mathysee the other month, and MY GOD WHAT A JOKE! Alexander was outpunched and knocked on his arse and STILL won on a card by 4 rounds im sure!! People are paying judges off these days and its sickening to see. I look at the UFC and see no such thing, even if it is not the sweet science of boxing. Its getting beyond rediculous. When Bob Arum goes out of boxing, it will be a revolution. He is like S. Blatter of FIFA. Ruining a great sport and dragging it through the mud. Making his fighters fight hanpicked bums as opposed to fighting mandatory challengers. Fighting champs at the real weight and not draining them aka Cotto@145lbs. And now recently he has been on about fighting Martinez but only if he can have a same day weigh in?! What? Hang on, Pacquiao won the WBC belt at 154lbs against Marg on a catch weight of 151lbs, so what stopping it happening? Why the Weigh in on the same day? The guy is making Pacman look like a chopper and if i were Pacquiao id do one. But saying that, he is making gazillions from fighting 2nd hand muppets. All be it apart from Marquez.....who bet pacman.....but didnt.

You're a very angry young man. Perhaps more suited to UFC...

Im only angry purely because of the way boxing is heading at the moment. What happened to fair and square dust ups and scraps. Mayweather went up and fought De La Hoya at L/M for example, and won. Never made the champ drain weight etc. I just feel that when Bob Arum leave boxing, then it will become a better place. What do you think??

Arum is a despicable slimy character, but it has been happening in boxing for years and years. Greats like SRL did it, so catchweights are nothing new. If it makes big fights happen then fine, but obviously I'd prefer them to be at the real weight.

This is nothing new in boxing. Robberies, corruption, discrimiantion, fighters using leverage, slimy promoters - its been happening since boxing began.

Valero's Conscience wrote:Personally i've gone off him quite a bit in the last 2-3 years.

I think the attention he's got over the last few years has gone to his head and resulted in a side effect of his head now positioned up his a-hole.

Lately he's spoken regarding Chavez Jr vs Alveraz and slated Alverez for demanding a catchweight and says he's against them. I know he's said before he's not keen on them but when you're star boy wins his last 2 'world titles' using catch weights which were both solely to their advantage I think he should keep his mouth firmly shut.

He's also slated Martinez lately in his attempt to protect/defend Chavez Jr not fighting him. How he has the nerve to criticise Martinez while protecting Chavez Jr is beyond me.

Roach is just embarrassing himself, he knows Martinez would destroy his fighter and if merely stalling and probably will try and go down the same route as he's taken with Pac, i.e. avoid and run until the other guy looks beatable which considering Martinez is 37 soon, he'll try and wait a year or two.

I also think he's gets a lot of sympathy because of his illness, which of course I feel sorry for him about but his comments shouldn't be ignored and are irrespective of it.

Not a horrible guy, just an irritating guy IMO. What do you think of him?

The catchweight thing with Manny annoys me that he's been allowed to pick up titles without fighting at the correct weight but I think it's a bold call to lay the blame at Roach's door.

None of us here can honestly say we know 100% what goes on with fight negotiations but my bet would be that many promoters/awarding bodies/tv companies love being associated with Manny and love saying that a fight is for a title as it gives them another tag line when selling. With that being said, I'd bet there is much pressure on both fighter's camps to find an agreeable weight just so a title can be added to the show.

Basically, I don't think Roach would be the leading protagonist in stipulating the catchweights and all terms of the fight.

As for being a bloke and trainer, I think he's great and have no shame in being with the bandwagon. Like Manos said earlier, there is an element of BS with his fighters but that's to be expected.

Generally speaking, I find him agreeable and clearly the dude gets results, just look at Khan!

Khan will be the fighter who seals the reputation of Roach, were it just Pacquiao then you could suggest it was a lucky fluke but turning around the careers of two contrasting talents proves his brilliance as a trainer.

ghosty surely it will be JCC jr!

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Khan will be the fighter who seals the reputation of Roach, were it just Pacquiao then you could suggest it was a lucky fluke but turning around the careers of two contrasting talents proves his brilliance as a trainer.

Agree. After Khan was exposed by Prescott (Well, not quite exposed, just "woken up"), Roach took him under his wing and has made him into a brilliant fighter. The power he has in his legs now has strengthened the way he takes a shot ie. Maidana. His power seems to have increased, especially with regards to his body shots. I think he could go really far. The chin of course is always going to be in question, but hey, if you can take a clean shot from Maidana and not be put on your arse, then maybe its not too bad.