Historians' all time rankings.

A thread to catalogue the rankings of fighters, historically, by various historians and organizations.

Just my opinion, but I would suggest that we preserve this purely as a reference, ( adding lists as we find them, ) and then open threads for the discussion of these rankings in the general boxing section.

IBRO rankings as of 2006 :

Heavyweight : http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=52

Lightheavyweight : http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=56

Middleweight : http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=424

Welterweight : http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=434

Lightweight : http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=443

Featherweight : http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=449

Bantamweight : http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=451

Flyweight : http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=461

Pound for pound : http://www.ibroresearch.com/?p=463

Ring Magazine 80 Greatest 1922-2002
1. Sugar Ray Robinson
2. Henry Armstrong
3. Muhammad Ali
4. Joe Louis
5. Roberto Duran
6. Willie Pep
7. Harry Greb
8. Benny Leonard
9. Sugar Ray Leonard
10. Pernell Whitaker
11. Carlos Monzon
12. Rocky Marciano
13. Ezzard Charles
14. Archie Moore
15. Sandy Saddler
16. Jack Dempsey
17. Marvin Hagler
18. Julio Cesar Chavez
19. Eder Jofre
20. Alexis Arguello
21. Barney Ross
22. Evander Holyfield
23. Ike Williams
24. Salvador Sanchez
25. George Foreman
26. Kid Gavilian
27. Larry Holmes
28. Mickey Walker
29. Ruben Olivares
30. Gene Tunney
31. Dick Tiger
32. Fighting Harada
33. Emile Griffith
34. Tony Canzoneri
35. Aaron Pryor
36. Pascual Perez
37. Miguel Canto
38. Manuel Ortiz
39. Charley Burley
40. Carmen Basilio
41. Michael Spinks
42. Joe Frazier
43. Khaosai Galaxy
44. Roy Jones Jr.
45. Tiger Flowers
46. Panama Al Brown
47. Kid Chocolate
48. Joe Brown
49. Tommy Loughran
50. Bernard Hopkins
51. Felix Trinidad
52. Jake LaMotta
53. Lennox Lewis
54. Wilfredo Gomez
55. Bob Foster
56. Jose Napoles
57. Billy Conn
58. Jimmy McLarnin
59. Pancho Villa
60. Carlos Ortiz
61. Bob Montgomery
62. Freddie Miller
63. Benny Lynch
64. Beau Jack
65. Azumah Nelson
66. Eusebio Pedroza
67. Thomas Hearns
68. Wilfred Benitez
69. Antonio Cervantes
70. Ricardo Lopez
71. Sonny Liston
72. Mike Tyson
73. Vicente Saldivar
74. Gene Fullmer
75. Oscar De La Hoya
76. Carlos Zarate
77. Marcel Cerdan
78. Flash Elorde
79. Mike McCallum
80. Harold Johnson

Heavyweight rankings, various :

http://coxscorner.tripod.com/heavylists.htm

ESPN 50 greatest to 2007

1. Sugar Ray Robinson
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Henry Armstrong
4. Joe Louis
5. Willie Pep
6. Roberto Duran
7. Benny Leonard
8. Jack Johnson
9. Jack Dempsey
10. Sam Langford
11. Joe Gans
12. Sugar Ray Leonard
13. Harry Greb
14. Rocky Marciano
15. Jimmy Wilde
16. Gene Tunney
17. Mickey Walker
19. Stanley Ketchel
20. George Foreman
21. Tony Canzoneri
22. Barney Ross
23. Jimmy McLarnin
24. Julio Cesar Chavez
25. Marcel Cerdan
26. Joe Frazier
27. Ezzard Charles
18. Archie Moore
28. Jake LaMotta
29. Sandy Saddler
30. Terry McGovern
31. Billy Conn
32. Jose Napoles
33. Ruben Olivares
34. Emile Griffith
35. Marvin Hagler
36. Eder Jofre
37. Thomas Hearns
38. Larry Holmes
39. Oscar De La Hoya
40. Evander Holyfield
41. Ted "Kid" Lewis
42. Alexis Arguello
43. Marco Antonio Barrera
44. Pernell Whitaker
45. Carlos Monzon
46. Roy Jones Jr.
47. Bernard Hopkins
48. Floyd Mayweather Jr.
49. Erik Morales
50. Mike Tyson

Bert Sugar Top 100

1. Sugar Ray Robinson
2. Henry Armstrong
3. Wille Pep
4. Joe Louis
5. Harry Greb
6. Benny Leonard
7. Muhammad Ali
8. Roberto Duran
9. Jack Dempsey
10. Jack Johnson
11. Mickey Walker
12. Tony Canzoneri
13. Gene Tunney
14. Rocky Marciano
15. Joe Gans
16. Sam Langford
17. Julio Cesar Chavez
18. Jimmy Wilde
19. Stanley Ketchel
20 Barney Ross
21, Jimmy McLarnin
22. Archie Moore
23. Marcel Cerdan
24. Ezzard Charles
25. Sugar Ray Leonard
26. Joe Walcott (The original)
27. Jake LaMotta
28. Eder Jofre
29. Emile Griffith
30. Terry McGovern
31. George Foreman
32. Johnny Dundee
33. Jose Napoles
34. Pascual Perez
35. Billy Conn
36. Ruben Olivares
37. Joe Frazier
38. Tommy Loughran
39. Sandy Saddler
40. Kid Chocolate
41. Abe Attell
42. Evander Holyfield
43. George Dixon
44. Maxie Rosenbloom
45. Larry Holmes
46. Ted "Kid" Lewis
47. Marvin Hagler
48. Pernell Whitaker
49. Carlos Zarate
50. Thomas Hearns
51. Battling Nelson
52. Beau Jack
53. Ricardo ;Lopez
54. John L. Sullivan
55. Carlos Monzon
56. Alexis Arguello
57. Carmen Basillio
58. Pete Herman
59. Charley Burley
60. Ike Williams
61. Kid Gavilan
62. Jack Britton
63. Dick Tiger
64. Pancho Villa
65. Panama Al Brown
66. Bob Fitszimmons
67. Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
68. Tiger Flowers
69. James J.Corbett
70. Tony Zale
71. Tommy Ryan
72. Georges Carpentier
73, Sonny Liston
74. "Kid" McCoy
75. Bob Foster
76. Freddie Welsh
77. Joe Jeanette
78. Jim Driscoll
79. Jersey Joe Walcott
80. Peter Jackson
81. Ad Wolgast
82. Jack Dempsey (The Nonpareil)
83. Manuel Ortiz
84. James J. Jeffries
85. Salvador Sanchez
86. Jimmy Barry
87. Carlos Ortiz
88. Roy Jones Jr.
89. Wilfredo Gomez
90. Aaron Pryor
91. Bernard Hopkins
92. Mike Gibbons
93. Jack Delaney
94. Johnny Kilbane
95. Willie Ritchie
96. Wilfredo Benitez
97. Packey McFarland
98. Rocky Graziano
99. Lew Jenkins
100. Mike Tyson

All time rankings of historian Tracy Callis, member of the IBRO and inductor for the IBHOF :

http://cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/callis-rankings.htm

IBRO Top 25 All Time (2006)

1. Sugar Ray Robinson
2. Harry Greb
3. Henry Armstrong
4. Muhammad Ali
5. Joe Louis
6. Sam Langford
7. Roberto Duran
8. Benny Leonard
9. Willie Pep
10. Bob Fitzsimmons
11. Joe Gans
12. Ezzard Charles
13. Benny Leonard
14. Jimmy Wilde
15. Eder Jofre
16. Mickey Walker
17. Archie Moore
18. Jack Dempsey
19. Jack Johnson
20. Gene Tunney
21. Stanley Ketchel
22. Joe Walcott
23. Rocky Marciano
24. Tony Canzoneri
25. Barney Ross

Some more from Nat Fleischer :

Light Heavyweights:

1 - Kid McCoy
2 - Philadelphia Jack O'Brian
3 - Jack Dillon
4 - Tommy Loughran
5 - Jack Root
6 - Battling Levensky
7 - Georges Carpentier
8 - Tom Gibbons
9 - Jack Delaney
10- Paul Berlenbach

Middleweights:

1 - Stanley Ketchell
2 - Tommy Ryan
3 - Harry Greb
4 - Mickey Walker
5 - Ray Robinson
6 - Frank Klaus
7 - Billy Papke
8 - Les Darcy
9 - Mike Gibbons
10- Jeff Smith

Welterweights:

1 - Joe Walcott
2 - Mysterious Billy Smith
3 - Jack Britton
4 - Ted Kid Lewis
5 - Dixie Kid
6 - Harry Lewis
7 - Willie Lewis
8 - Henry Armstrong
9 - Barney Ross
10- Jimmy McLarnin

Lightweights:

1 - Joe Gans
2 - Benny Leonard
3 - Owen Moran
4 - Freddy Welsh
5 - Battling Nelson
6 - George Kid Lavigne
7 - Tony Canzoneri
8 - Willie Ritchie
9 - Lew Tendler
10- Ad Wolgast

Featherweights:

1 - Terry McGovern
2 - Jim Driscoll
3 - Abe Attell
4 - Willie Pep
5 - Johnny Dundee
6 - Young Griffo
7 - Johnny Kilbane
8 - Kid Chocolate
9 - George K.O. Chaney
10- Louis Kid Kaplan

Bantamweights:

1 - George Dixon
2 - Pete Herman
3 - Kid Williams
4 - Eder Jofre
5 - Joe Lynch
6 - Bud Taylor
7 - Johnny Coulon
8 - Frankie Burns
9 - Eddie Campi
10- Panama Al Brown

Flyweight:

1 - Jimmy Wilde
2 - Pancho Villa
3 - Frankie Genaro
4 - Fidel La Barba
5 - Benny Lynch
6 - Elky Clark
7 - Johnny Buff
8 - Midget Wolgast
9 - Peter Kane
10- Pascual Perez

(From the 1972 edition of The Ring Record Book and Boxing Encyclopaedia)

I mentioned in the thread header that, in my opinion, this isn't the place to debate these lists, but I should imagine that were we to raise them for debate in the general boxing section these from Fleischer would inspire very passionate debate, even though this particular set was published not long before his death in 1972.

Nat Fleischer, Founder of Ring Magazine, 1958, 1971.

Jack Johnson
Jim Jeffries
Bob Fitzsimmons
Jack Dempsey
Jim Corbett
Joe Louis
Sam Langford
Gene Tunney
Max Schemling
Rocky Marciano


Charley Rose, 1968

Sam Langford
Jack Johnson
Jack Dempsey
Joe Louis
Jim Jeffries
Gene Tunney
Sam McVey
Rocky Marciano
Jim Corbett
Max Baer


Nat Loubet, 1975

Joe Louis
Jack Dempsey
Jim Jeffries
Jack Johnson
Rocky Marciano
Gene Tunney
Bob Fitzsimmons
James J. Corbett
Muhammad Ali
Joe Frazier


Bert Sugar, 1991

Jack Dempsey
Joe Louis
Muhammad Ali
Jack Johnson
Gene Tunney
Rocky Marciano
Joe Frazier
Larry Holmes
Sonny Liston
Mike Tyson


Nigel Collins, 1997

Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
Evander Holyfield
Larry Holmes
George Foreman
Jack Johnson
Rocky Marciano
Joe Frazier
Jack Dempsey
Sonny Liston


ESPN, 2007

Joe Louis
Muhammad Ali
Jack Dempsey
Jack Johnson
Gene Tunney
Rocky Marciano
Ezzard Charles
George Foreman
Joe Frazier
Larry Holmes


ESPN was a reader's poll.

Hmm... Bert Sugar has some interesting views, can't see I agree with his list, though the right people but completely skewed from where I would have mine!

Muhammad Ali's top 10 heavyweights from Atlas and Sugars book of boxing lists. He excludes himself.

1) Jack Johnson
2) Jack Dempsey
3) Gene Tunney
4) Joe Louis
5) Ezzard Charles
6) Jersey Joe Walcott
7) Rocky Marciano
8) Joe Frazier
9) George Foreman
10) Larry Holmes

Bert Sugars top ten heavyweights.

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Jack Johnson
4. Jack Dempsey
5. Gene Tunney
6. Rocky Marciano
7. George Foreman
8. Larry Holmes
9. Sam Langford
10. Joe Frazier

Teddy Atlas's top ten heavyweights.

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Jack Johnson
4. Rocky Marciano
5. Gene Tunney
6. Jack Dempsey
7. Sam Langford
8. John L. Sullivan
9. Larry Holmes
10. Sonny Liston

Bert Sugar's top 10 all time light heavyweights

1) Archie Moore
2) Ezzard Charles
3) Tommy Loghran
4) Maxie Rosenbloom
5) Billy Conn
6) Bob Foster
7) Harold Johnson
8) Roy Jones Jr
9) Philadelphia Jack O'Brien
10) Micheal Spinks