2016 season thread

[Lowlandbrit]

First topic message reminder :

Here's your 2016 hub, pick out your own good, bad and ugly from the new crop of jerseys.

AG2R La Mondiale (FRA)	Astana Pro Team (KAZ)	BMC Racing Team (USA)
Cannondale Pro Cycling Team (USA)	Dimension Data (RSA)	Etixx - Quick-Step (BEL)
FDJ (FRA)	IAM Cycling (SUI)	Lampre Merida (ITA)
Lotto Soudal (BEL)	Movistar Team (ESP)	ORICA GreenEDGE (AUS)
Team Giant-Alpecin (GER)	Team KATUSHA (RUS)	Team LottoNL-Jumbo (NED)
Team Sky (GBR)	Tinkoff (RUS)	Trek-Segafredo (USA)

World Tour races:

[Mad for Chelsea]

Good grief that was so close, but looks like Cavendish may have got it by the narrowest of margins. YES! Stage given to Cavendish, takes it from Greipel by a matter of millimetres. Fantastic sprint!

Level with Hinault now on 28 stage wins

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

The peloton can't ride for only 15km at the end and expect Cav to not win - fantastic from the Manxman, a real shot at Mercx's record now

[Hammersmith harrier]

I fully appreciate what Cavendish is capable of but his 28 stage wins pale in comparison to those of Mercxx and Hinault, hell they collectively mean less than Froome's ride up Ventoux.

[owen10ozzy]

Absolute nonsense Hammersmith!

[Hammersmith harrier]

Explain how it's nonsense then Owen.

[Guest]

They don't pale in comparison at all, to say his 28 stage victories, over his entire career, collectively, don't even add up to Froome's one ride up Ventoux, is embarrassing & insulting.

[owen10ozzy]

I don't think it even needs an explanation, if your saying it just to cause some debate and conversation then fair enough but if you genuinely think that collectively they don't even add up to Froomes one ride up Ventoux then you need to stop watching cycling; a comment like that deserves an explanation not the statement declaring it nonsense.

[Hammersmith harrier]

I don't think you truly understand road cycling Owen otherwise you'd have made a comment that a degree of substance to it.

28 stage wins sounds impressive but what have they got Cavendish aside from good sponsorship money, a single green jersey. Froome's ride up Ventoux won him the yellow jersey, for that simple reason it means more than all of Cav's collectively, road cycling is about doing day after day after day not just on the days that suit you.

[Mad for Chelsea]

There's always one who says "Yes Cavendish may be winning all these stages, but he's never competed for the GC". It's a silly viewpoint. Cyclists offer different things, and are of different types: GC rider, Classics rider, sprinter, domestique, breakaway specialist, lead-out man, etc. Bernie Eisel has made an entire career out of looking after Cavendish, shielding him in the peloton on the flat stages and driving the "bus" on the mountains to make sure they make the cut. On paper, Eisel has never achieved anything in his career. In practice, he's been invaluable, hence why Cavendish has taken him with him to every team he's joined (see also, Mark Renshaw, though his role is more visible).

Cavendish's wins brings the team lots of money, both from the prizes and from the sponsors. Froome couldn't do what Cavendish does, and obviously Cavendish can't do what Froome does. One can't really compare, but the fact remains that Cavendish is probably the greatest sprinter of all time (Cipollini deserves a mention, but I'd take Cav every time): his ability to win sprints with or without a train is remarkable. In terms of GC riders, Froome is at best a footnote right now.

[whocares]

Without a train? cavendish still has his mate Renshaw working for him like during the HTC glory days and a very experienced team including EBH and Eisel. Not taking anything from his achievement as the amount of sprinter stages has also gone down in recent years. Will be interesting to see how he does in Rio in Omnium.

[whocares]

Sorry MFC nights have read your post a bit too quickly

[Hammersmith harrier]

I should qualify my statement a bit better then, to me the GC is the only thing that matters in the grand tours; the sprint or mountains classifications are good to win but ultimately I don't really care or remember who wins them. That is why I favour Froome's ride up Ventoux so much, beyond the fact it was one of the most demonstrations of climbing you'll ever see, it effectively won him the overall.

I appreciate what Cavendish can do and is without equal in grand tour sprinting but it feels like too much of a sideshow to the real nitty gritty of the race.

[dummy_half]

I should qualify my statement a bit better then, to me the GC is the only thing that matters in the grand tours; the sprint or mountains classifications are good to win but ultimately I don't really care or remember who wins them. That is why I favour Froome's ride up Ventoux so much, beyond the fact it was one of the most demonstrations of climbing you'll ever see, it effectively won him the overall.

I appreciate what Cavendish can do and is without equal in grand tour sprinting but it feels like too much of a sideshow to the real nitty gritty of the race.

That's the issue though - to most teams, winning a single stage of the TdF makes it a successful race for them / their sponsors. Realistically at most 5 teams start with a contender for the GC with a few others looking to hold a good place, so the rest have to find a way of winning something and getting some coverage. Having someone like Cav, who can win multiple stages over multiple years, is invaluable, and that's why now 4 teams have paid the big money to bring him + Renshaw and Eisel into their roster.

I'm not claiming that his 28 stage wins + 1 green jersey is even close to Hinault's 28 stage wins and 5 yellow jerseys, but it certainly shouldn't be dismissed as a side show - he's easily the most successful sprinter at winning TdF stages (Andre Darrigade being next with 22, and many of the great sprinters only having about a dozen stage wins each), and it's certainly not an easy thing to dominate the sprints.

[Guest]

Despite winning his 27th stage at the Tour de France at the start of the race, Cavendish holding the yellow jersey for one day for the first time in his career was a significant achievement for him.  It sort of demonstrates how important is winning the yellow jersey and being in possession of it at the end of the race.

That said seeing the peloton hovering up breakways as it winds in and around the road systems like an organic animal picking up speed and thinning out towards the end of a flat Tour stage and then a winner emerging from that lot is one of the greatest spectaculars in sport.

[Lowlandbrit]

They sorted that out a bit quicker than yesterday. Thought Coquard had it there.

[Guest]

Had £5 bets on Van Avermaet @34/1 & Steve Cummings in the bets today.

Happy man!!!

Looking forward to seeing Pierre Rolland win me some money later in the tour in a break.

Van Avermaet in yellow!!!

[Guest]

Congrats. I always forget to put some bets on, for the potential breakaway stages. A stellar ride from Van Avermaet, leads by over five minutes. De Gendt in polka dot. Nibali completely blown today & Contador losing some time again, I think.

[Guest]

Cavendish makes it 29

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Cavendish makes it 29

Just purely outsprinted Kittel - impressive.

Also great performance from Daniel McLay finishing 3rd!

[Lowlandbrit]

Also great performance from Daniel McLay finishing 3rd!

Couple of top 10 finishes before today too, he's having a good race.

[Guest]

Has Cavendish got better or Kittel and Greipel got worse compared to the past few years?  Maybe Cavendish track training in preparation for the Olympics has allowed him to gain top end speed.  He has in the past talked about having to change body weight between optimising track performance compared to optimising road racing performance - so has he been modifying his muscle mass and muscle distribution?

[Guest]

Anyone doing some bets for tomorrow's stage? Hopefully the breakaway isn't allowed to much time, so £5 on Romain Bardet, given that descent is tomorrow's bet. Nibali looked awful two days ago, but might be worth a shout.

[Guest]

I'm going Rui Costa & Steve Cummings to get in the breakaway, stage suits both perfectly. Agree on Bardet, but think he'll be with the GC guys, then attack just before the top.

[dummy_half]

It's a difficult day to call tomorrow - first true mountain and the finish being after a relatively short descent would suggest the GC riders could looking to put down an early marker, but it's only one climb (and a 4th cat earlier), and a tougher day on Saturday, so maybe a day for a 2nd level climber or attacking rider. Costa and Cummings not bad candidates, and Cummings particularly has already lost enough time that the peloton will let him go (Costa may be a bit too close to the leaders).

I'd have suggested Adam Yates as a contender, but he's still level on time with the main GC contenders and too good a climber to give a head start to. Perhaps Rafa Majka if Tinkoff have given up on Contador for the overall...

[Guest]

Our choices of Cummings & Nibali have a chance here

[Guest]

I put £5 on Bardet, Nibali & Cummings. As long as the peloton don't close it, we could be in business.

[Guest]

Gonna be difficult for Cummings to hang on. Nibali chasing with the man in yellow, Van Avermaet

[Guest]

Cummings got a minute lead with 8k to go

[dummy_half]

Cummings still doing a great job - 3km of the climb to go and holding about 1 minute lead over Nibali and a couple of others. If he can get over the top with 30s in hand, he should be able to make it...

[Guest]

C'mon Cummings. Could be dimension data's fourth stage win

[Guest]

C'mon Cummings. Could be dimension data's fourth stage win

Cummings takes the victory. We're not doing too bad with this betting so far. Expect Froome will be favourite over the weekend.

[Lowlandbrit]

How great it would it be if it turned out that arch coming down was just the first of a number of Wacky Races style boobytraps Van Avermaet has planned to keep hold of the yellow jersey until Paris?

[Guest]

Van Avermaet leads Julian Alaphillipe in second by 6:36. Alejandro Valverde in third at 6:38

[dummy_half]

GVA will be giving the jersey away tomorrow though - he'll just have a fun day in the laughing group and give up 30 minutes on the GC contenders. He's done a good job today though to hold the jersey for a day longer and even to increase his lead.

Expect to see Froome and Quintana at the front tomorrow - the first day someone can make a potentially race-winning move rather than just have a race losing day.

[Guest]

Having looked at tomorrow's stage, it's a killer. Not an mountain top finish, unlike Stage 9, so I'm hoping Froome & Quintana decide to just mark each other & allow a non-threatening breakaway to take this.

Going to bang some £££££ on Rui Costa & Ruben Plaza to make the break, they stand out as good options. If the main GC guys do attack late on, you can't look past, Romain Bardet, as his descending skills could snatch it at the end.

[Guest]

Those two do stand out. You know who is guaranteed to be in the break, Mr. Voeckler.

[Guest]

Break not being allowed to take this. Expect fireworks later in the peloton

[Guest]

Froome leads with 7k to go

[Guest]

Surprised Bardet did not get on the wheel of Froome just as they were going over the top. Top descent by Froome though, already looks ominous.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Contador and Valverdr attack on the first climb of the day

Renshaw has had to abandon due to illness - huge blow to Cav

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Pinot, Majka and Valverde in a leading group of 19 who have about two minutes on a depleted peloton early on stage 2

Rolland already dropped post crash yesterday

[Guest]

Contador pulls out

[Lowlandbrit]

Dumoulin's certainly having a better day than yesterday, when he had to take an emergency stop at a camper van to use the toilet.

[Mad for Chelsea]

Someone want to tell Quintana he's allowed to attack and doesn't have to just sit in Froome's wheel all day? Movistar have some excellent riders, but such a boring team...

Great to see Yates clinging on with the very best

And a very fine ride from Dumoulin.

[Guest]

Quintana is just a big let down. Let me guess, he'll wait until the third week, when he's over two minutes behind & then start attacking Froome, probably on the penultimate day. Disappointing day too, as I had Costa in my bet, but not on an each way.

[Lowlandbrit]

Only 5 riders haven't made it to the first rest day, and everyone lasted at least a week. Didn't see that coming after the first stage.

[Guest]

Michael Matthews won today, out-sprinting Sagan & Boassen Hagen. I had the Norweigen on a bet, so disappointing to miss out today.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Expecting a win for Greipel or Kittel today - been a long hard day in the saddle and I think their brute strength might just be enough

[Guest]

Imagine Cavendish will quit now

Bored of Froome

[Mad for Chelsea]

Well that was fun. Sagan and a fellow Tinkoff rider initiate a move about 12-13 km from the end, and Froome and Thomas go with them. The quartet work together really well to get to the finish (Thomas dropping off in the last km), where Sagan unsurprisingly takes the stage. Froome follows him in second and will pick up a handful of seconds over his main contenders (plus six seconds time bonus).

Main bunch slow to respond, sprinters teams only doing the work once Cavendish dropped out of the peloton with a mechanical, but by then it was too late. Lovely stuff

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