John Mitchell - All Blacks former captain and coach says Ireland are realistic World Cup winners.

This sort of talk was really inevitable.  10 wins in a row including against South Africa, Australia, England and France.

What I like about this Ireland team and Joe Schmidt, is that the only thing anyone inside the camp will be thinking about is the Wales game up next in the 6N.  Which Paul O'Connell has identified as Ireland's toughest game, as unlike the game against England, it is away from home.

Interested to gauge the opinion of v2ers on this, are Ireland contenders for the whole shabang, and if not are any of the 6N?

http://www.espn.co.uk/six-nations-2015/rugby/story/258325.html

Sorry - link now added to OP.

Yup they are. Along with Wales, France and England they will think they have a realistic chance. Anyone needs a slice of luck along the way, key bounce, keep players injury free, stumble through a game and suddenly it's very real.

Yes. It's a shame that they have not got the monkey off their back of having never beaten the All Blacks because that is another mental hurdle they will (probably) have to face if they are to go all the way. However, on their day, it is evident that they can beat anyone. Furthermore, they have shown that they can produce a sequence of winning games. There are a few question marks that they've not had to face: 1) what happens if key players get injured; 2) can they produce the same winning sequence against the very best in the short timeframe of a WC?
We'll see, but I bet no one will fancy playing against them.

"They have beaten both the Springboks and Wallabies, and England and France twice each"

Thats not quite correct but we will take it thanks John.

Jesus - first Guscott, now this guy.

The Jinx Ireland Early brigade are up and at it

Ireland will probably be disappointed with anything less than a semi-final appearance, and rightly so. They must surely be favourites to top their group, setting up a likely quarter-final with Argentina, who despite improving would still be obvious underdogs.

like as has been mentioned, anything can happen in the World Cup, but with a fully fit squad (plenty of opportunities to rotate in that group) and a run of confidence, this Ireland team could be real contenders.

As the song goes Curly.

Only you can make this world seem right
Only you can make the darkness bright
Only you and you alone
Can thrill me like you do
And fill my heart with love for only you

We're only thinking about you

The first of 3 matches between us leading up to the RWC, I guess this sets the bench mark!

All Semi-Final previews I hope

On a serious note.  What Schmidt is bringing to the party, and perhaps Nucifora in the background, is much more important actually than the 2015 World Cup. It really is.

The stoppage of the crazy downturn we were going through a few years ago (9th in the world), the revitalisation of enthusiasm of Irish players to wear the shirt and play consistently hard and sincerely in it - and the organisational background stuff that allows fringe players to come in and really put their bodies on the line and look to steal places off their superiors.... those are the things that are impressing me.

The hunger has returned, but it's controlled by science and reason now - it isn't mad dog.  And it's breeding a background of younger players looking at how it's all done and learning the more clinical methods of imposing youself.

I think Schmidt's role with Ireland is much more important in the influence he's having in the background.  His perfectionism is being observed and even if and when he goes, I don't think Ireland will be for going backways on the principles he brings of concentrating on minute details.
We've always been a so-so nation but raw with energy and passion that often got us killed by technique.  Our culture is changing and I think our natural rawness will be complimented by stricter guidelines.

So I'm more interested in our long term future than the actual 2015 WC.  If we get even stronger in consistency, and if we have more young players coming in already well advanced in their teaching, then whatever titles might come our way in the future will come.  

Flash pan victories I'm not interested in.  Long term intent and intensity is what I'm wishing for.... even after Schmidt goes.

Ireland are the best team in the NH so far. That does not mean that they will win the RWC any more than England,or Wales will.

Here is an article from early last year where Ben Darwin predicts on theroar that Ireland will make the final.

http://www.theroar.com.au/2014/05/12/predicting-2015-rugby-world-cup-bracket/

He was probably the first.

Actually, was Nacewa saying stuff very early too? Putting his money where his mouth was. Seem to recall something there.

Nacewa............. I Shall Return!

GunsGerms wrote:Here is an article from early last year where Ben Darwin predicts on theroar that Ireland will make the final.

http://www.theroar.com.au/2014/05/12/predicting-2015-rugby-world-cup-bracket/

He was probably the first.

Well actually I've been saying it since 2003.

I wouldn't doubt that, rodders. Not for a sec would I doubt it.

rodders wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:Here is an article from early last year where Ben Darwin predicts on theroar that Ireland will make the final.

http://www.theroar.com.au/2014/05/12/predicting-2015-rugby-world-cup-bracket/

He was probably the first.

Well actually I've been saying it since 2003.

Actually you were Dr doom for the last few years Rodders.

GunsGerms wrote:

rodders wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:Here is an article from early last year where Ben Darwin predicts on theroar that Ireland will make the final.

http://www.theroar.com.au/2014/05/12/predicting-2015-rugby-world-cup-bracket/

He was probably the first.

Well actually I've been saying it since 2003.

Actually you were Dr doom for the last few years Rodders.

Guns, I see you are getting a lot of red thumbs over on the score for your comments on POM!

GunsGerms wrote:

rodders wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:Here is an article from early last year where Ben Darwin predicts on theroar that Ireland will make the final.

http://www.theroar.com.au/2014/05/12/predicting-2015-rugby-world-cup-bracket/

He was probably the first.

Well actually I've been saying it since 2003.

Actually you were Dr doom for the last few years Rodders.

Was I? Suppose it depends on what day you catch me on.

What's Ireland record like on the road?

nathan wrote:What's Ireland record like on the road?

Well we've produced the likes of Joey Dunlop and Eddie Irvine, so pretty good I'd say.

We've only lost once away from home since Schmidt took over,by 3 points to England last year.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:We've only lost once away from home since Schmidt took over,by 3 points to England last year.

Did England have as many injuries last year as this year?

its too early to tell really as you havent beaten any of the other top 6 ranked teams in the world away under schmidt (havent played anyone in top6 away apart from england last year)

beating wales would be an essential milestone to keep RWC hopes building.

quinsforever wrote:its too early to tell really as you havent beaten any of the other top 6 ranked teams in the world away under schmidt (havent played anyone in top6 away apart from england last year)

beating wales would be an essential milestone to keep RWC hopes building.

not necessarily. We'll be meeting them twice before the WC anyway, I hear. So a good few opportunities for them to hit us or us to hit them before the WC.

But I'd sure like the win now.

quinsforever wrote:its too early to tell really as you havent beaten any of the other top 6 ranked teams in the world away under schmidt (havent played anyone in top6 away apart from england last year)

beating wales would be an essential milestone to keep RWC hopes building.

France were in the top 6 when we beat them,it's getting into technicalities but that was a major win for us simply due to our dire record in Paris.Beating Wales away even though they are definitely a better team than France wouldn't have the same impact as we have a weirdly good record in Cardiff.(The Irish record against Wales in the whole 5/6 Nations championship is a bit of an anomaly.)

quinsforever wrote:its too early to tell really as you havent beaten any of the other top 6 ranked teams in the world away under schmidt (havent played anyone in top6 away apart from england last year)

beating wales would be an essential milestone to keep RWC hopes building.

would tend to agree ordinarily but you are missing the point...look at their pool and likely draw. Fairly easy ride with a likely quarter v Argies, Semi v England (who will of course win their group) If they have got there with Sexton fit then anything is possible, NZ or not.

was replying to someones specific question about how good this ireland are at winning away from home.

wales losing to japan gifted ireland a doozy pool and quarter final route if they win their group.

quinsforever wrote:was replying to someones specific question about how good this ireland are at winning away from home.

wales losing to japan gifted ireland a doozy pool and quarter final route if they win their group.

It's payment for us opening up the last World Cup for European sides by beating Australia in our pool. Neither France nor Wales have ever thanked us for their run

SecretFly wrote:
I think Schmidt's role with Ireland is much more important in the influence he's having in the background.  His perfectionism is being observed and even if and when he goes, I don't think Ireland will be for going backways

Yes, just like Matt O'Connor and Leinster have taken full advantage of the legacy of Schmidts "Blue machine" of 2010-2013 (RIP).

FecklessRogue wrote:

SecretFly wrote:
I think Schmidt's role with Ireland is much more important in the influence he's having in the background.  His perfectionism is being observed and even if and when he goes, I don't think Ireland will be for going backways

Yes, just like Matt O'Connor and Leinster have taken full advantage of the legacy of Schmidts "Blue machine" of 2010-2013 (RIP).

Head Up... the Great Protector and Battle Prince Nacewa is rumoured to be returning to give voice to Schmidt's way once more. Because big Leo Cullen surely forgot most of it!

I still don't know who the hell chose O'Connor to come here..... and if Schmidt was involved in the decision he should be ashamed of himself and retire from his current job forthwith!

FecklessRogue wrote:

SecretFly wrote:
I think Schmidt's role with Ireland is much more important in the influence he's having in the background.  His perfectionism is being observed and even if and when he goes, I don't think Ireland will be for going backways

Yes, just like Matt O'Connor and Leinster have taken full advantage of the legacy of Schmidts "Blue machine" of 2010-2013 (RIP).

Well, lets hope Schmidt and Nucifora don't leave the same legacy they left with the Auckland Blues.

Sin é wrote:

Well, lets hope Schmidt and Nucifora don't leave the same legacy they left with the Auckland Blues.

We'll survive.  We've already survived Armageddon after the last outfit

If Ireland are to be contenders they'll have to get rid of that clueless kicking strategy they adopted against England. 58 times they put boot to ball, and they only got 19 points from it.

45 times boot was put to ball and 19 points came from 6 of them.

england put boot to ball 27 times and 9 points came from 3 of them.

seems like kick more = score more

oh wait, was there something about possession too?

Well as Schmidt himself alluded to, up until last weekend the team that kicked most was England.

Kicks from hand (the offender kicks to taste and decency and proper rugby decorum) before the weekend's game:

England - 59
Ireland - 49

After the England game:

England - 82
Ireland - 87

I'll keep an eye on those to the end of the championship.  I'd hate if we lost that 'Championship' too to the English

SecretFly wrote:Well as Schmidt himself alluded to, up until last weekend the team that kicked most was England.

Kicks from hand (the offender kicks to taste and decency and proper rugby decorum) before the weekend's game:

England - 59
Ireland - 49

After the England game:

England - 82
Ireland - 87

I'll keep an eye on those to the end of the championship.  I'd hate if we lost that 'Championship' too to the English

i don't think those are accurate numbers per se. I think you need to count every time that boot is put to ball - because it could make a difference. For example, England's kickoffs or re-starts to Ireland followed a distinct pattern of Kick to Zebo (5 times), then kick to Bowe, then kick once to Kearney. They got the ball once.

Equally, Ireland's kicks break down into things like re-starts, free kicks, penalty kicks from hand, relieving kicks, grubber kicks, pressure kicks, territory kicks, and shots from the tee. Of which there were 58 in total.

Pot Hale wrote:

SecretFly wrote:Well as Schmidt himself alluded to, up until last weekend the team that kicked most was England.

Kicks from hand (the offender kicks to taste and decency and proper rugby decorum) before the weekend's game:

England - 59
Ireland - 49

After the England game:

England - 82
Ireland - 87

I'll keep an eye on those to the end of the championship.  I'd hate if we lost that 'Championship' too to the English

i don't think those are accurate numbers per se.   I think you need to count every time that boot is put to ball - because it could make a difference.   For example, England's kickoffs or re-starts to Ireland followed a distinct pattern of Kick to Zebo (5 times), then kick to Bowe, then kick once to Kearney.   They got the ball once.

Equally, Ireland's kicks break down into things like re-starts, free kicks, penalty kicks from hand, relieving kicks, grubber kicks, pressure kicks, territory kicks, and shots from the tee.   Of which there were 58 in total.

No no...you can't include penalty kicks and free kicks....

The media circus about Ireland is the up and unders and the box kicks.

Ireland have been oscillating around the top 8 rankings for some time but aren't in the top two positions - so that would indicate that they should not expect to make the final. Having never made a semi-final in their history a realistic goal is to reach the last four - that would be an achievement.

Could Ireland win - yes in the way every team who is in the competition could win. So while it might be theoretically possible, probabilities would suggest Ireland aren't realistic candidates to win. The English pundits are only talking Ireland up because to do otherwise would undermine England further on the world stage in a very important RWC year. If Ireland weren't promoted as contenders where would that leave England in the wake of Sunday and more importantly where would that leave the pundits and whatever else they're peddling in what should be a windfall year for them.

Mitchell too is jumping on the "but seriously, someone other than NZ could win" bandwagon, to generate a modicum of excitement and spread the weight of expectation from his team. He's not fooling anyone.

Mitchell says Ireland can win it?

Well, thats them gone then...

Pity, I gave them a chance...now they're well and truly hexed...

Taylorman wrote:Mitchell says Ireland can win it?

Well, thats them gone then...

Pity, I gave them a chance...now they're well and truly hexed...

He also said New Zealand WOULD win it


......................bye bye Taylorman.......

SecretFly wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Mitchell says Ireland can win it?

Well, thats them gone then...

Pity, I gave them a chance...now they're well and truly hexed...

He also said New Zealand WOULD win it


......................bye bye Taylorman.......

yeah I know...we're probably stuffed as well...anything Mitchell touches turns to jam...where in the World is he plying his trade these days? Maybe he's trying to soften up some Irish club...hmmm

If Ireland win the RWC at least they will do so playing drab rugby

http://m.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11412365

ebop wrote:If Ireland win the RWC at least they will do so playing drab rugby

http://m.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11412365

"I've actually got big concerns about the game at the moment, because there are not enough tries being scored, which is turning the fans away," said Hansen, a former Wales coach who has set the standards with the All Blacks.

This is the usual nonsense you hear from down south every few years.

How many tries did NZ score in the 2011 RWC final Steve?

"It's best for rugby all round if the other blokes let us do our business easier and score some more tries. It's what the public want"

Thanks for that Hanson. We'll all certainly consider your proposal.

Its Englands lack of running rugby that ruined it for me, they only gained 501 meters with the ball in hand.

My guess is there is as many tries being scored in international rugby as there ever has.

Certainly more than the final last time......

I think we could at least improve on that record if we got there.....

Italy and Scotland have sorted it out. France even managed one against Wales for the first time in years.

Its only "your lot"who are ruining it GG. Stop spoiling Hansens 6 nations or he will be forced to watch Super Rugby instead.


Joking aside it would be nice if we got rid of the flankers, set pieces, and made the defending side retreat after the tackle