Who Has The Better Welterweight Record: Pacquiao or Mayweather?

Neither of today's top two welterweights crack an all-time top five (at 147 lbs) for me, but who has the better resume as a welterweight?
 
Pacquiao
 
7-2
 
De la Hoya W RTD 8
Cotto W TKO 12
Clottey W UD 12
Mosley W UD 12
Marquez W UD 12
Bradley L SD 12
Marquez L KO 6
Rios W UD 12
Bradley W UD 12
 
Mayweather
 
9-0
 
Mitchell W TKO 6
Judah W UD 12
Baldomir W UD 12
Hatton W TKO 10
Marquez W UD 12
Mosley W UD 12
Ortiz W KO 4
Guerrero W UD 12
Maidana W MD 12

Floyd was saying he's been fighting at welter for 10 years.

Still hasn't had a big fight.

Bradley gives it to Manny in fighters beat.........I guess the Marquez face down fight and the fact Mayweather played with him evens it out.......

I agree about the top 5 welter comment............

Pick Hearns to beat both and maybe Curry/Leonard as well...Napoles and Robbo......Benitez would be pickem..

Pick both to beat Duran at 147.........Though 135 is a much harder call..

Starling If the underdog against Mayweather would be tight...........(Always better when expected to lose!!) I'd pick Starling to beat Manny..(Style that's made for him !!)..

Both excellent records.

Not so easy. Margarito was at LMW btw.

Mayweather +
Unbeaten Hatton was an excellent win
Marquez win I rate a lot, and don't put as much emphasis on the weight as most. He outboxed him, not outmuscled him
Cotto was post Pacquiao, still a top win
Dominated a slightly better Mosley
Ortiz/Guerrero good next tier wins

-ve
Maidana performance wasn't great
Lot of inactivity

Pacquiao +
Cotto possibly the best WW win either of them have
Two wins against Bradley, one of the best of the rest
Rios better than Ortiz/Guerrero

-ve
Knocked out and caused nightmares against someone Mayweather dominated
Mosley/DLH were well past their best
Last performance against Bradley was poor considering Tim didn't turn up

I think Pacquiao has the slightly better names but has been less convincing. I'd side with Mayweather based on his consistency and level of performances.

Cheers -- amended. Mayweather fought Cotto at light middle.

Ah of course. Confused me because Floyd didn't gain weight...or something. I don't think there's much in it and probably comes down to how much you mark someone down for losses. I think some give people more credit for facing better opponents even if they don't win than I do.

D4 for instance ???.........  

Not a great deal in it. Pacquiao has the stand out performance (Cotto) and better wins with Bradley and Cotto but had the struggles with Marquez to balance it out.

Strongback wrote:Floyd was saying he's been fighting at welter for 10 years.

Still hasn't had a big fight.

It'd be lovely if you were objective, just once. I'd love to see what a fair and thought out argument looked like from you.

Not one big fight? Hatton and Marquez were huge fights. Don't try and pick them apart, Hatton was undefeated.

Manny edges it, a prime Bradley for me is the best win on either of their records at any weight except for maybe Barrera.

The way manny completely demolished the P4P #3 in Bradley is better than anything Mayweather has done at the weight.

JabMachineMK2 wrote:

Strongback wrote:Floyd was saying he's been fighting at welter for 10 years.

Still hasn't had a big fight.

It'd be lovely if you were objective, just once. I'd love to see what a fair and thought out argument looked like from you.

Not one big fight? Hatton and Marquez were huge fights. Don't try and pick them apart, Hatton was undefeated.

Marquez before he was on the Meme Shakes and Ricky 'not a welter' Hatton?

You've got to do better than this.

Why has Manny taken harder fights? Be objective.

until Mayweather is flat on his back or out boxed like Manny was vs Marquez then Floyd has the better record. Mayweather made harder work of Cotto but he beat Marquez so easily. At best Manny has a draw and maybe a win against JMM in four fights.

I agree, that's why I think Marciano is above Ali, he was never dropped by Super Cooper, or unboxed by Norton.

Little between there wins but what does seperate them is the losses that Pacquiao has had, either way he's lost twice at the weight in my opinion to Marquez twice while beating Bradley twice.

What I will say about the Bradley is that I don't think he'd be getting as much credit for it had he not been robbed first time around. People bemoan Hattons lack of form at the weight but Bradleys isn't much better, a win over a 40 year old Marquez and a win over somebody I don't rate in the slightest Provodnikov. Bradleys future form at Welterweight is going to make or break that win.

Hardly the same when the fighter that put Manny to sleep couldn't lay a glove on Floyd

When did Pacquiao completely demolish Bradley?

Tough one, the stand out performance was undoubtedly Pacquiao versus Cotto, as Cotto is a favourite of mine I was completely in awe of PAC Man that night. Flip side of the coin, Mayweather made such light work of JMM who has given PAC untold troubles over the years. A case of styles making fights.

I'd give the edge to Pacquiao just because I could never picture Mayweather putting in a performance like he did against Cotto. On the balance of things I think he has a better resume and has put on more impressive performances. Mayweather's consistency is undeniable however

I know I'm not going to be popular after this but has Manny been the same since PED accusations? Probably just a coincidence, am not accusing him but has to be Said. Him and Khans best wins were when Ariza was strength coach.

Was Marquez hanging around with Meme when he fought Floyd?  No he was a fat bloated little guy.

All the top  guys do it now especially as they get older.  Not doing it would be too much of a disadvantage.

Can open. Worms. Everywhere

Strongy ur probably right was just trying to add a bit of controversy to the subject, my bad

I'm just saying, didn't Floyd pay a lot of money to a court not to have his tests revealed? Pretty sure he shut up about Manny right after that.

I'd personally like to see Popkins results, full blood test.

like I said on the deleted Anthony Joshua thread, Nevada allows you to have something like six times the normal testosterone levels, quite easy then, to dope, even when you aren't doping, if you know what I mean

kingraf wrote:I'm just saying, didn't Floyd pay a lot of money to a court not to have his tests revealed? Pretty sure he shut up about Manny right after that.

I'd personally like to see Popkins results, full blood test.

like I said on the deleted Anthony Joshua thread, Nevada allows you to have something like six times the normal testosterone levels, quite easy then, to dope, even when you aren't doping, if you know what I mean

Alledgedly Manny got hold of failed test results from Floyd. Floyd's court case against Manny died on the spot and a payment went to Pacquao.

Its part of top level boxing. I wouldn't go into a fight clean if the other guy was at it.

I guess it comes down to who you prefer to who has the best record because its so easy to apply spin to favour the fighterw you prefer and claim to be unbiased...Mayweather demolished a small Marquez, Floyd was over limit, the Marquez who KO'd Manny was massive (on peds), Hatton was never that good or Hatton was unbeaten, Floyd took something out of Hatton and he blew between fights.. thats why Manny KO'd him. Mosely was over the hill against Manny, Mosely wobbled floyd etc etc.

Amateur mma fighters I know dope so would be surprised if pro boxers don't

Pacquiao's wins over Cotto and Bradley trump any of Floyd's wins at 147. I think he has the finer record at welterweight when you see them side-by-side.

Probably because amateur mma fighters they dont get tested as often as professional boxers, who would pay for it?

Strongback wrote:

kingraf wrote:I'm just saying, didn't Floyd pay a lot of money to a court not to have his tests revealed? Pretty sure he shut up about Manny right after that.

I'd personally like to see Popkins results, full blood test.

like I said on the deleted Anthony Joshua thread, Nevada allows you to have something like six times the normal testosterone levels, quite easy then, to dope, even when you aren't doping, if you know what I mean

Alledgedly Manny got hold of failed test results from Floyd.  Floyd's court case against Manny  died on the spot and a payment went to Pacquao.

Its part of top level boxing. I wouldn't go into a fight clean if the other guy was at it.

ALLEGEDLY ........................That's your favorite word isn't it !!! ....Whether it's Hearn or anyone else you don't like..

You are a coward..

Just calm down a bit Truss 

amateur mma fighters, can't for the life of me understand why anyone takes a Kimura lock for free...

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Strongback wrote:

kingraf wrote:I'm just saying, didn't Floyd pay a lot of money to a court not to have his tests revealed? Pretty sure he shut up about Manny right after that.

I'd personally like to see Popkins results, full blood test.

like I said on the deleted Anthony Joshua thread, Nevada allows you to have something like six times the normal testosterone levels, quite easy then, to dope, even when you aren't doping, if you know what I mean

Alledgedly Manny got hold of failed test results from Floyd.  Floyd's court case against Manny  died on the spot and a payment went to Pacquao.

Its part of top level boxing. I wouldn't go into a fight clean if the other guy was at it.

ALLEGEDLY ........................That's your favorite word isn't it !!! ....Whether it's Hearn or anyone else you don't like..

You are a coward..

'You are a coward'...........I like the dramatics.


Here's what your mate Thomas Hauser wrote about Mayweather and PED's.


"On May 20, 2012, a rumor filtered through the drug-testing community that Mayweather had tested positive on three occasions for an illegal performance-enhancing drug.

More specifically, it was rumored that Mayweather’s “A” sample had tested positive on three occasions and, after each positive test, USADA had found exceptional circumstances in the form of inadvertent use and gave Floyd a waiver. This waiver, according to the rumor, negated the need for a test of Floyd’s “B” sample. And because the “B” sample was never tested, a loophole in USADA’s contract with Mayweather and Golden Boy allowed the testing to proceed without the positive “A” sample results being reported to Mayweather’s opponent or the Nevada State Athletic Commission (which had jurisdiction over the fights).

In late-May, Pacquiao’s attorneys heard the rumor. On June 4, 2012, they served document demands and subpoenas on Mayweather, Mayweather Promotions, Golden Boy and USADA calling for the production of all documents that related to PED testing of Mayweather for the Shane Mosley, Victor Ortiz and Miguel Cotto fights.

The documents were not produced. There was a delay in the proceedings while Floyd spent nine weeks in the Clark County Detention Center after pleading guilty to charges of domestic violence and harassment. Upon his release from jail on August 2nd, settlement talks heated up.

On September 25, 2012, a stipulation of settlement ending the defamation case was filed with the court. The parties agreed that the terms of settlement would be kept confidential. Prior to the agreement being signed, two sources with detailed knowledge of the proceedings told this writer that Mayweather’s initial monetary settlement offer was “substantially more” than Pacquiao’s attorneys had expected it would be and an agreement in principle was reached soon afterward.

As part of the settlement, the Mayweathers and Mayweather Promotions issued a statement that read: “Floyd Mayweather Jr., Floyd Mayweather Sr., Roger Mayweather and Mayweather Promotions wish to make it clear that they never intended to claim that Manny Pacquiao has used or is using any performance-enhancing drugs nor are they aware of any evidence that Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs. Manny Pacquiao is a great champion and no one should construe any of our prior remarks as claiming that Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs.”

I don’t know if Floyd Mayweather or Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs or not.

I do know that, if Mayweather’s “A” sample tested positive for a performance-enhancing drug on one or more occasions and he was given a waiver by USADA that concealed this fact from the Nevada State Athletic Commission, his opponent and the public, we have an ingredient that could contribute to the making of a scandal."


http://www.maxboxing.com/news/max-boxing-news/the-ped-mess-part-one



Stick that in your pipe and smoke it mofo.

Roger coming out and slurring Manny basically admitted his nephew was scared of Manny.


And anyway if peds were so good, how come they never gave Floyd superhuman power?


Never be a top ten in my book Floyd Mayweather, for swerving out of his biggest fight.

Floyd would have beaten the Pooch

Panny wouldnt take the test because he scared of needles

Strongback wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Strongback wrote:

kingraf wrote:I'm just saying, didn't Floyd pay a lot of money to a court not to have his tests revealed? Pretty sure he shut up about Manny right after that.

I'd personally like to see Popkins results, full blood test.

like I said on the deleted Anthony Joshua thread, Nevada allows you to have something like six times the normal testosterone levels, quite easy then, to dope, even when you aren't doping, if you know what I mean

Alledgedly Manny got hold of failed test results from Floyd.  Floyd's court case against Manny  died on the spot and a payment went to Pacquao.

Its part of top level boxing. I wouldn't go into a fight clean if the other guy was at it.

ALLEGEDLY ........................That's your favorite word isn't it !!! ....Whether it's Hearn or anyone else you don't like..

You are a coward..

'You are a coward'...........I like the dramatics.


Here's what your mate Thomas Hauser wrote about Mayweather and PED's.


"On May 20, 2012, a rumor filtered through the drug-testing community that Mayweather had tested positive on three occasions for an illegal performance-enhancing drug.

More specifically, it was rumored that Mayweather’s “A” sample had tested positive on three occasions and, after each positive test, USADA had found exceptional circumstances in the form of inadvertent use and gave Floyd a waiver. This waiver, according to the rumor, negated the need for a test of Floyd’s “B” sample. And because the “B” sample was never tested, a loophole in USADA’s contract with Mayweather and Golden Boy allowed the testing to proceed without the positive “A” sample results being reported to Mayweather’s opponent or the Nevada State Athletic Commission (which had jurisdiction over the fights).

In late-May, Pacquiao’s attorneys heard the rumor. On June 4, 2012, they served document demands and subpoenas on Mayweather, Mayweather Promotions, Golden Boy and USADA calling for the production of all documents that related to PED testing of Mayweather for the Shane Mosley, Victor Ortiz and Miguel Cotto fights.

The documents were not produced. There was a delay in the proceedings while Floyd spent nine weeks in the Clark County Detention Center after pleading guilty to charges of domestic violence and harassment. Upon his release from jail on August 2nd, settlement talks heated up.

On September 25, 2012, a stipulation of settlement ending the defamation case was filed with the court. The parties agreed that the terms of settlement would be kept confidential. Prior to the agreement being signed, two sources with detailed knowledge of the proceedings told this writer that Mayweather’s initial monetary settlement offer was “substantially more” than Pacquiao’s attorneys had expected it would be and an agreement in principle was reached soon afterward.

As part of the settlement, the Mayweathers and Mayweather Promotions issued a statement that read: “Floyd Mayweather Jr., Floyd Mayweather Sr., Roger Mayweather and Mayweather Promotions wish to make it clear that they never intended to claim that Manny Pacquiao has used or is using any performance-enhancing drugs nor are they aware of any evidence that Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs. Manny Pacquiao is a great champion and no one should construe any of our prior remarks as claiming that Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs.”

I don’t know if Floyd Mayweather or Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs or not.

I do know that, if Mayweather’s “A” sample tested positive for a performance-enhancing drug on one or more occasions and he was given a waiver by USADA that concealed this fact from the Nevada State Athletic Commission, his opponent and the public, we have an ingredient that could contribute to the making of a scandal."


http://www.maxboxing.com/news/max-boxing-news/the-ped-mess-part-one



Stick that in your pipe and smoke it mofo.

You really are pathetic.......and I think you know it deep down..

Why has it become accepted that it was Floyd dodging the fight now, when most thought it was 50/50 at the time?

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Strongback wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Strongback wrote:

kingraf wrote:I'm just saying, didn't Floyd pay a lot of money to a court not to have his tests revealed? Pretty sure he shut up about Manny right after that.

I'd personally like to see Popkins results, full blood test.

like I said on the deleted Anthony Joshua thread, Nevada allows you to have something like six times the normal testosterone levels, quite easy then, to dope, even when you aren't doping, if you know what I mean

Alledgedly Manny got hold of failed test results from Floyd.  Floyd's court case against Manny  died on the spot and a payment went to Pacquao.

Its part of top level boxing. I wouldn't go into a fight clean if the other guy was at it.

ALLEGEDLY ........................That's your favorite word isn't it !!! ....Whether it's Hearn or anyone else you don't like..

You are a coward..

'You are a coward'...........I like the dramatics.


Here's what your mate Thomas Hauser wrote about Mayweather and PED's.


"On May 20, 2012, a rumor filtered through the drug-testing community that Mayweather had tested positive on three occasions for an illegal performance-enhancing drug.

More specifically, it was rumored that Mayweather’s “A” sample had tested positive on three occasions and, after each positive test, USADA had found exceptional circumstances in the form of inadvertent use and gave Floyd a waiver. This waiver, according to the rumor, negated the need for a test of Floyd’s “B” sample. And because the “B” sample was never tested, a loophole in USADA’s contract with Mayweather and Golden Boy allowed the testing to proceed without the positive “A” sample results being reported to Mayweather’s opponent or the Nevada State Athletic Commission (which had jurisdiction over the fights).

In late-May, Pacquiao’s attorneys heard the rumor. On June 4, 2012, they served document demands and subpoenas on Mayweather, Mayweather Promotions, Golden Boy and USADA calling for the production of all documents that related to PED testing of Mayweather for the Shane Mosley, Victor Ortiz and Miguel Cotto fights.

The documents were not produced. There was a delay in the proceedings while Floyd spent nine weeks in the Clark County Detention Center after pleading guilty to charges of domestic violence and harassment. Upon his release from jail on August 2nd, settlement talks heated up.

On September 25, 2012, a stipulation of settlement ending the defamation case was filed with the court. The parties agreed that the terms of settlement would be kept confidential. Prior to the agreement being signed, two sources with detailed knowledge of the proceedings told this writer that Mayweather’s initial monetary settlement offer was “substantially more” than Pacquiao’s attorneys had expected it would be and an agreement in principle was reached soon afterward.

As part of the settlement, the Mayweathers and Mayweather Promotions issued a statement that read: “Floyd Mayweather Jr., Floyd Mayweather Sr., Roger Mayweather and Mayweather Promotions wish to make it clear that they never intended to claim that Manny Pacquiao has used or is using any performance-enhancing drugs nor are they aware of any evidence that Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs. Manny Pacquiao is a great champion and no one should construe any of our prior remarks as claiming that Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs.”

I don’t know if Floyd Mayweather or Manny Pacquiao has used performance-enhancing drugs or not.

I do know that, if Mayweather’s “A” sample tested positive for a performance-enhancing drug on one or more occasions and he was given a waiver by USADA that concealed this fact from the Nevada State Athletic Commission, his opponent and the public, we have an ingredient that could contribute to the making of a scandal."


http://www.maxboxing.com/news/max-boxing-news/the-ped-mess-part-one



Stick that in your pipe and smoke it mofo.

You really are pathetic.......and I think you know it deep down..

No need to sulk kid.

Yeah yeah you win...Okay   

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Yeah yeah you win...Okay   

I remember when you were competitive.

Scott - quite simple really. Perception is reality - Floyd beat Marquez, who gave Manny fits... Manny is ducking. Floyd gets hit 200 times by rather crude Maidana, well obviously Manny would duff him up. Stick around till November for the annual Manny-Marquez battle, which correlates with the annual changeover of opinions.

My perception is you like Manny and don't like Floyd.......Looking at your posting history Kingy...

Great fighters tend to find a way to win.........After four fights with JMM.....Manny is still looking..

Ali did with Kenny.......Louis did with Walcott 2........Robbo did with Turpin.....

Mayweather may have looked crap but he beat Maidana..

Quite perceptive you are. I don't like Floyd. Unbeaten record is unimpressive, as it highlights either a steady stream of below par opposition, or the odd bit of assistance from judges whose eyes were trained to accentuate your strengths. He also gave that damn bartender a massive tip when he was in S.A, which is enough really.

I'd like to see how the supped up version of JMM would do against Floyd now. Would be interesting to compare and contrast.

Ali didn't find a way to beat Kenny, he found a way to impress judges whose eyes were receptive to showboating, and "dancing" and everything except, you know, hitting him. Fair play, takes lots of charisma, and Artistry to actually get away with it.

Swap Frazier then If you want to

You seem hung up on this showboating crap recently Raf, Mayweather won at the weekend because he was the better man for more than half the fight.

A win is a win, and Manny has two over Marquez. He's real problem is he seems incapable of not going back to the well.

Ali was well past it when he fought the third Norton fight..

He won the second and consensus would agree..

Mate I'm not hung up on anything, I scored it for Floyd - I said as much, and don't think I've said it differently, there's a one round difference between your card and mine...

That doesn't change the fact that a chosen few fighters do have the ability of maximising minimal work. Like I said, fair play.