PGA Tour: No Longer the "Fifth Major"?: Notes from the Ballwasher

First topic message reminder :

1).What a week! We learned the importance of being Ernst, the legacy of Linda Watson's driver, and saw a weekend when the Island 17th green at TPC was truly an island.

2).Ernst first, and a salutary reminder that a golfer making his PGA Tour debut, as Derek Ernst did, with a 6-under-par round of 65 at last year's Fry's.com event, is well worth watching. He came straight through the final old-style Q-School which is yet another example that not all golfers who earn their PGA Tour cards via Q-School are ill-equipped to handle the rigours of the Tour.

3).And Fred Couples of course is another who turned pro on a whim, borrowed enough money to enter a mini-Tour event, cashed a cheque for $1,800.00 and hot-footed it to Q-School where he earned his card. The rest is history and a deserved place in the World Golf Hall Of Fame where he told the story of lifting Tom Watson's wife's driver from Watson's garage and using it during his early Tour career.
A characteristic "aw shucks" speech from Freddie on Monday night as he was inducted into the WGHOF; interesting the stories told about how much Lee Trevino meant to his career and very emotional as he left the stage sobbing uncontrollably.

4).Apart from Derek Ernst, Quail Hollow also saw a return to form for Robert Karlsson and Ross Fisher, both of whom earned "higher spots" in the "rookie" money list as the second reshuffle was announced.
Life on Tour is fickle though and both Fish and Karlsson get this week off and will probably be on the shelf for all but a couple of the next six weeks as we enter the season of invitationals, Players and US Open. The top ten free pass for the next full-field event will get them in to the Byron Nelson which they'd get into anyway. Then, unless they receive an invitation, they'll miss Colonial and the Memorial, play Memphis (scene of Karlsson play-off losses in 2010 and 2011) hopefully and only get a trip to Merion if they qualify. No-one said this would be easy.
And kudos to David Lynn, not just for his terrific performance last week but a great "rookie" season. He says he won't be back in the States until the PGA Championship but hopefully common sense will persuade him to take his place at Merion and play the Bridgestone (assuming he stays in the Top 50).

5).After noting last week that Justin Rose led the field in greens in regulation at New Orleans, Rory McIlroy led the stat at Quail Hollow, only to finish close to the bottom of the all-important "strokes gained putting" stat.
But Rory now leads the "All Around" ranking of PGA Tour players and the leaders are quite reflective of the season so far - in order:
McIlroy, Woods, Rose, Sneds, Horschel, Henley, Stads, Hoffman, Walker, Jason Day, Kirk.

6).Ernie Els continued his globe-trotting with a successful-ish trip to Indonesia, hardly the ideal preparation for a Players tournament where he has seldom contended. But perhaps he nails the status of The Players in the minds of most international players when he blogs the Championship "is about as big as it gets (on the PGA Tour) outside of a major or WGC event".

7).The magic sponge has apparently worked wonders on almost a dozen players who opted out of last week's Wells Fargo event, and Dustin Johnson (hope security is up to snuff for him), Crane, Goosen, Jacobson and Poulter, to name a few, will return to action at Pete Dye's most famous course, if not his best. And Vijay returns after bolting from Charlotte at the last minute to consult his lawyers.

8).I like 17/18th's of the course, but consider the 17th to be among the very worst holes in Championship golf. But, of course, it's the one everyone writes about so I will too, with a few stat's from pgatour.com:
~11% of tee shots on #17 find the drink.
~Robert Allenby has played #17 36 times since last taking a bath. Rollins (30) and Singh (29) also have impressive runs since splashdown.
~Of those playing this week, Bob Estes and Baddeley have hit eight balls in to the water over the past ten years, Mickelson has drowned 7. (Boring Bob Tway has nine but thankfully he's on the Champions Tour now.)
~Paul Azinger is the only player in the history of the Players to birdie #17 in all four rounds (in 1987).
~The Most Interesting Man in the World has the last hole-in-one here, in 2002

9).Americans dominate the list of winners at "TPC" but, since Sandy Lyle broke through 26 years ago, "Internationals" have more than held their own with victories from Elkington (2), Price, Norman, Perks, Scott, Ames, Garcia, Stenson, Clark and KJ Choi. Europeans have contended regularly, with runners up finishes from Faldo, Langer (2), newly minted WGHOF'er Montgomerie, Harrington (2), Donald, Poulter and Martin Laird. Brian Davis has played well here, Westwood should arguably have beaten Clark in 2010, and McDowell led until going completely haywire in 2012, while Jacobson, Kaymer and Pettersson have finished well without really contending. Sergio is leading money-winner here and I'd expect he, Stenson, Donald (3 top 6's these past 8 years), Poulter, McDowell and Westwood all to enjoy good weeks.

10).I really can't find good value among the Americans and would think a half-crown each way investment on long shots would give far better value than the media favourites. My ten bob will go on Chris Stroud and David Toms.
This is a compelling tournament to watch on a course that rewards precision and penalises mistakes more than most. The weather should mostly be fine (chance of Sunday showers, and moderate breezes the only flies in the ointment) after last weekend's deluge which saw much of the course submerged.
Power is a virtue only if you hit the ball straight, but decent ball-striking and a magical short game will be rewarded. Think an in-form Snedeker. But Snedeker is not in great form and perhaps another International streak will begin!

Rules violation?

Nope.


“I saw it perfectly off the tee,” explained Wittenberg, who tied for seventh after a 3-over 75 Sunday. “I told him exactly where I thought it crossed, and we all agreed.”

Wittenberg reiterated that Woods actively consulted with him in order to determine the point where the ball last crossed the hazard.

“We talked to each other,” he said. “I told him I thought it crossed on the corner of the bunker right where he took his drop.

“There is no doubt, guys,” Wittenberg added. “The ball crossed where he dropped.”

Following the conclusion of play, the PGA Tour released the following statement regarding the situation:

"Without definitive evidence, the point where Woods' ball last crossed the lateral water hazard is determined through best judgment by Woods and his fellow competitor,” the statement read. “If that point later proves to be a wrong point (through television or other means), the player is not penalized by Rule 26-1 given the fact that a competitor would risk incurring a penalty every time he makes an honest judgment as to the point where his ball last crosses a water-hazard margin and that judgment subsequently proves incorrect (Decision 26-1/17)."

monty,
The aerial shot, which NBC only showed once, appeared to show the ball heading out over water early in its flight.
The NBC commentator on the ground, and Miller, both expected a drop about 75 yards off the tee.
Later Miller said he thought Woods was pushing the envelope, or words to that effect, with his drop.

Probably made very little difference but he certainly wasn't hanging about waiting for an official's opinion. Seemed he intimidated Rules Officials and NBC as well as, as usual, his fellow competitors.

As I say, probably would still have made double bogey but clearly wasn't going to leave things to chance. Or a review of the rules.

Even the Tour's statement on the subject was wishy washy.


Sr,
Yup, I read that too, but it's telling that NBC only showed one overhead shot, Rolfing clearly thought it was over H2O straight off the tee and Miller came back and said his blah, blah, blah, Tiger gave himself a favourable drop.
Why wouldn't they question it? As I say, probably would still have made a six but it just didn't look right, and the evidence was quickly sequestered.


C'est la vie.

Woods win at Merion?

Hey, why not ... but if history is to be trusted, he only wins on Public Access tracks. At uber-private Merion, the blood runs blue.

Shotrock wrote:Woods win at Merion?

Hey, why not ... but if history is to be trusted, he only wins on Public Access tracks. At uber-private Merion, the blood runs blue.

And that matters exactly how? or why?

Robo

Not sure shotrock meant anything other than a light hearted observation that tigers US open wins have come at courses where you are I could rock up and play. Well, rock up, sleep in your car and then play in some cases.

He was also runner up at pinehurst.

I guess tiger is just a man of the people.


Sergio entering the sad part of a Europeans career where it is clear a major is never going to happen and people start referring to them as "ryder cup hero".

Also a sad day for tiger in some ways as it confirms his major draught is all in his head. His game is as well equipped as it ever was to beat the other guys, it just seems he can't beat himself come the majors.

He needs to "fluke" a third round 66 or something to have any chance of getting back on the major wagon.


I guess we should also note Laird was a final hole bogey away from a T2, his fans will be pleased to see his win was not a one off and that he may be back to some better form.

Also worth noting that this win (tigers 78th) means tiger passes Sam sneads individual win tally on the pga tour of 77;

http://www.golfchannel.com/news/jason-sobel/woods-can-unofficially-pass-snead-with-masters-win/

Actually the main point is it shouldn't be that hard to count how many snead should have. It is clear however that team events shouldn't count.

was there a problem with the drop? the ball pitched 12 yards in from dry land and given the hard draw shape on it, it makes sense that the last point of entry would have been late in its flight.

did you ring in kwini?!

Went to bed looking like advantage Garcia. Woke up to a Woods win and El Whinge way back. Excellent.
Couldn't see any problems with the drop, nor from what I remember did the Sky commentary team.

The Sky commentators asked Howard Clarke as they saw the one overhead replay and it seemed a bit generous from that. Clarke said it looked fine to him and he was at the front of the tee apparently.

I think it's just the inevitable legacy of the Augusta drop - everything he does will be questioned now. I don't necessarily think that's a bad thing, though.

GOlf is officially boring again.

That's still a relatively benign comment SR.

That week in the Tiger Woods posting sunshine really has had an effect...

I'd feel the same if it was anyone dominating one sport.
Must be boring being a "fan " of such people/teams to see them win all the time.

He doesn't win all the time. Only about 25% of the time. I think there are/were more dominant participants in other sports.

In a large field where there isn't a "draw" structure, that's still too much, plus coverage is sycophantically sickening. Intolerable.

my guess is the point of entry looked dodgy on tv. images from the blimp can be deceptive. everyone on the ground thought it was ok including Roger Maltbie.

Robo - Just an observation ... But for the record I don't particularly like Tiger's chances at Merion. Why? Because if his driver is even a little off, he'll find life miserable.

Now I know his driver has not been off as of late, but it seems to be one of the first things to go when his game ebbs and flows (as all do).

What's more, no one has less experience than he does on this course. (Many, however, have the same amount.)

Local professionals interviewed and Donald and McDowell seemed to top that list of likely winners.

Good win by Tiger, sad finish for Garcia, who did himself no favours (IMHO) in getting involved in a spat with Woods. As for Merion, Tiger's scrambling looks pretty good, although it's not just his driver that can be wayward, it's his driving - I think it was a 3W he hit of the 14th, although I could be wrong.

What was the spat? Or do they just not like one another?

incontinentia,
Maltbie wasn't following that group - he didn't see it except, as we did, via TV. Rolfing clearly thought he might have to drop way back, as did Miller - his comments discussed yesterday.
In the end he would probably still have made a six so the actual outcome of that hole is a moot point.

Conspiracy theorists (viz: moi) might conclude there were hidden agendas in play.


Shotrock: Time you went to Scotland . . . . !
Plus: Surely, Tiger won't need to use a driver at Merion will he? You've told us a lot about the single-file fairways but I'd think it's the green complexes that will be the differentiator - how big the greens are, how the surrounding areas will be coiffed, is a marginal miss as penal as at Sawgrass, etc, etc.

Can't honestly see why Tiger will be at too much of a physical disadvantage if he can easily use 5-wood when others have to use the big stick. It's probably the mental bit that would get him, if anything does - don't really see how he can be left out of the equation on this week's form.

As I said, it is tigers mind and not his clubs or swing that will stop him winning majors in this form. I have no doubt he could win just using a 5 wood but I dont trust his mental abilities in majors anymore.

With all the controversy recently with where to drop a ball, wouldn't it make sense to just have drop zones designated to every water hazard and make it compulsory for the players to drop in them. They are still losing a shot and it will save time and remove any sense of injustice.

McLaren wrote:As I said, it is tigers mind and not his clubs or swing that will stop him winning majors in this form. I have no doubt he could win just using a 5 wood but I dont trust his mental abilities in majors anymore.

Be surprised if he isn't feeling 10% or so stronger mentally after winning the Players. Was a wide open last day in a huge event and he was the one who closed it out.
Lets face it he's looking like he could run away with a major in the first three days at the moment and just coast home the forms he's in.

Leaving tomorrow Kwin!

Also I should have said tee ball instead of driver. Here's the Merion opportunity in a nutshell:

Only two par 5's (holes 2 and 4), make bogey there and life could be difficult. Fairway twiggy narrow on #2.

Last 4 holes should be bears. Surprising elevation to contend with and hazards that will play like water hazards.

Speculation that on one day the Par 3 3rd may play longer than the par 4 11th. If true, that may be a first.

Hay to be made on the short par 4's (7,8, 10, 11)

Has Woods regained the intimidation factor though?

i think he has

YES!!!
Not sure he ever really lost it.

I agree YES, but he had lost it. I think the top Europeans (Rory, Sergio and Westwood) don't have the mental resolve to beat Tiger head to head. I think it's up to the US players to challenge Tiger.

Not sure Sergio is in the top 3, or even the top 5 or 6, Europeans.

Think it's too soon to rule out Rory taking on Woods and prevailing... McDowell has shown he can do it too.

I think Rory's got no issue taking Tiger on head-to-head. Two majors to Tiger's zero since Rory started winning them.

I also think American players are less likely to step up to the plate given they've grown up in middle of the myth that is TW.

Shotrock wrote:I think Rory's got no issue taking Tiger on head-to-head. Two majors to Tiger's zero since Rory started winning them.

I also think American players are less likely to step up to the plate given they've grown up in middle of the myth that is TW.

That point isn't really valid imo.....that is like saying everyone who has won a major since, has no fear of Tiger.

Honda last year was proof that Tiger doesn't scare Rory when he's on form.

But clearly Rory in a different league than other major winners in that time frame. Vaulted to World #1, multiple majors at such a young age, his beat down at Congressional one for the ages ... just don't think he's the least bit intimidated by Tiger.

Look forward to the head-to-head battles though.

The Honda Classic last year.....Tiger was nowhere near where he is at the moment. He is 100 times better than he was last year plus Tiger was miles behind the lead, hardly a head to head battle.

He surged through the field a few holes ahead of Rory, and finished second. Hardly miles behind the lead, and exactly the sort of thing that would have had other players stumbling where Rory didn't blink.

Shotrock wrote:Robo - Just an observation ... But for the record I don't particularly like Tiger's chances at Merion. Why? Because if his driver is even a little off, he'll find life miserable.

Now I know his driver has not been off as of late, but it seems to be one of the first things to go when his game ebbs and flows (as all do).

What's more, no one has less experience than he does on this course. (Many, however, have the same amount.)

Local professionals interviewed and Donald and McDowell seemed to top that list of likely winners.

I guess it all boils down to what we mean by "like his chances"

If "like his chances" means should he be the prohibitive favorite? Then I would say YES. WHO would I pick over him when his play at the PLAYERS was the blueprint for playing Marion? At MOST he would use driver 4 times a round at Merion, but more likely 1 or 2 if even that. He can still comfortably reach the par-5 2nd with 3 or 5 metal off the tee. Par-5 4th will probably be unreachable at least 2 if not all 4 days. That leaves 5, 6 and 18 as the only candidates for driver. Now do I think GMac can win... absolutely. I think his game would suit Marion well... but Luke... not so much. "Short and Crooked" is no way to go through life son... and Luke's got a case of the left/rights off the tee creeping back into his game.

But if "like his chances" means do I think he will win... then my answer is likely no. IMO The PLAYERS is also a blueprint for why. Look how tightly bunched the Players field stayed until the very end. IMO Merion is likely to produce the same kind of bunching. So while I believe TW will be a contender... IMO it's likely to become a numbers game as I'm thinking he'll be among a bunch of contenders come Sunday. One mistake by TW or one hot final round by another... and TW doesn't get it done.

My attitude... is probably best exemplified by a couple of fantasy games I play. In one of them I can play TW 10 times for the season. I've already used him 5 times... will use him at Memorial and AT&T... which leaves me TW for 3 plays. DOUBTFUL I'd use one of those on Marion. But in the Golf Channel game I can pick TW as often as I like... and I'll pick him EVERY single time he plays. (that is baring some injury or "issue" if you get my drift). I mean 4 out of 7 on the PGAT... 4 out of 8 if you include Abu Dhabi... that's about as lock a pick as there possibly can be in golf. Now if Rory were playing anything like last year, or Snedeker the way he was earlier this year... I might reconsider. But I see no single player out there who I could pick over TW in anything right now...

Spot on robo, my sentiments exactly.

I also think Tiger might have won the battle yesterday only to lose the war at Merion - the buzz over his "drop" ain't going away anytime soon and the USGA, or their walking officials who didn't like what they saw on Sunday, will be scrutinizing his every move. A completely different type of pressure for someone who, let's face it, is used to applying it to others.

PS: Don't ask me why most of my Tiger options are still in my bag - another pathetic yahoo year!

PPS: Good for Jeff Maggert.

kwinigolfer wrote:Spot on robo, my sentiments exactly.

I also think Tiger might have won the battle yesterday only to lose the war at Merion - the buzz over his "drop" ain't going away anytime soon and the USGA, or their walking officials who didn't like what they saw on Sunday, will be scrutinizing his every move. A completely different type of pressure for someone who, let's face it, is used to applying it to others.

PS: Don't ask me why most of my Tiger options are still in my bag - another pathetic yahoo year!

PPS: Good for Jeff Maggert.

IMO dropgate2 won't have any effect on TW by Merion... and if anything TW might think walking officials with each group would probably be a relief instead of a burden at this point. If Tiger was able to get over the Masters dropgate1 to win at the Players, I see no reason why this should bother him in the U.S. Open. Bottom line, IMO this one is much more clear cut than the Masters deal. It was 100% legitimate drop... PERIOD. That is unless we're ready to call Casey Wittenberg a liar (which I'm not sans evidence of such). If CW did in fact tell TW he saw where it crossed (even if he's ultimately wrong about the exact spot), the drop is 100% proper within the clearly written rules with no need of some questionable application of some clause... unlike the 33-7 deal ala the Masters. And by the way, I don't see any USGA guys having any problem with this one way or the other. It wasn't a RULES question... it was a flight of a ball question... they're experienced enough to understand the difference. They've seen enough to know that if they weren't there to see it, then they have little to go on to question it. Also, REAL rules officials (instead of bloggers) are used to taking player's testimony and accepting their word in many rulings. IMO if any USGA type official would have walked up on that scene and asked CW what he saw and if he repeated the same thing he did to the media, then it would have been a 100% "drop is fine, case closed" with them.

But to be clear... just don't ask me to opine if CW was correct in identifying the correct spot or not. I have NO FREEKING CLUE. but as a guy who knows "angles", I know the overhead video was misleading because it wasn't straight down the fairway... and rat cam clearly showed the ball violently hooking... so who knows. But either way, I sure got a kick out of that Zapruder or make that the Oliver Stone... ummm I mean the that "documentary" by that John Ziegler guy

And as for Maggert... Yeah.. good for Jeff. I hung around all day just to see him today, but didn't. So I'm staying over tonight and will head home after I catch up with him... hopefully. Did get a chance to listen in on Paddy's presser today and he spent a lot of time with other media within my earshot after. I really enjoy listening to this guy. He had lots of interesting comments about scheduling in general during the presser and more from a Dual Tour players perspective after... good stuff