Saracens vs Toulon

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Saracens vs Toulon


The English league leaders backed by South African and English financial muscle vs the French team 2nd in the Top 14 backed by comic book financial muscle (Mourad Boudjellal).

3 of the English backers of Saracens are on the times rich list - Nigel Wray (230m), Nick Leslau (200m) Dominic Silvester (150m)

Anyone know the wealth of Mourad?

Head to heads to look out for:

Farrell vs Wilkinson - the obvious one.

Borthwick vs Kennedy - the lineout battle.

Tomkins vs Bastearaud - the ex rugby league offloading machine vs the ultimate french battering ram

Vunipola vs Hayman - daunting challenge for the young Englishman vs the experience of one of the best tightheads in the world.

Brown vs Lobbe - two of the best backrowers in the world will duel.

Shame Fraser is likely to miss out because S.Armitage vs him would have been really interesting.

I could go on and on.



Alain Rolland has been picked as officiating the game.

After his last match my feelings are mixed. Should have red carded a racing metro player in the HC group match he officiated after just 4 minutes but he penalised Racing Metro a lot after that.


Both sides lost their recent matches on the weekend but neither will be too fussed. Obviously both have eyes on this match.

OK. Nantes, Boston Mass or Cape Town then.

SecretFly wrote:It's a HC semi-final...
A virtual England V France game. Surely that should get 'rugby fans' into the stadium for a big day out? Surely it isn't about price and more about proof of a lethargic interest in anything (both sides perhaps) that isn't League.

Not exactly many French on display though

Tickets sold 25,000.
Combined capacity of both teams home grounds 24,700.

At a minimum ticket price of £35 not many Quins fans will go. If they had made it £20 then perhaps they may have done. If they had made it £10 the stadium would have been full.

lostinwales wrote:

SecretFly wrote:It's a HC semi-final...
A virtual England V France game. Surely that should get 'rugby fans' into the stadium for a big day out? Surely it isn't about price and more about proof of a lethargic interest in anything (both sides perhaps) that isn't League.

Not exactly many French on display though

I was actually going to include a little aside joke about that ironic twist...but I decided to delete it and play the point straight...for a change.

Montpellier, France to Clermont-Ferrand, France 333km >3hrs

Barnet to Leicester (for example) 92 miles ~ 1.5hrs

LondonTiger wrote:Tickets sold 25,000.
Combined capacity of both teams home grounds 24,700.

At a minimum ticket price of £35 not many Quins fans will go. If they had made it £20 then perhaps they may have done. If they had made it £10 the stadium would have been full.

Sorry, Tiger...I just do not believe the difference of 15 quid is keeping fans away. And that's even including the fact that economic woes are ongoing and bill paying/living money are a squeeze for many in Europe. 15 quid isn't going to be the difference for a European one off semi-final.

Tickets sold has nothing to do with price. Its just that Sarries don't have a large fan bas. There were far more Ulster fans than Saracens in the QF.

Sarries by 5

SecretFly wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:Tickets sold 25,000.
Combined capacity of both teams home grounds 24,700.

At a minimum ticket price of £35 not many Quins fans will go. If they had made it £20 then perhaps they may have done. If they had made it £10 the stadium would have been full.

Sorry, Tiger...I just do not believe the difference of 15 quid is keeping fans away. And that's even including the fact that economic woes are ongoing and bill paying/living money are a squeeze for many in Europe. 15 quid isn't going to be the difference for a European one off semi-final.

Sarries can sell out Wembley and Twickenham - when they set the price. I am not willing to go when it will cost me over £100 for me and my daughters, I might have done if it was £30-40.

Sarries do not have a large regular fan base - they get 10,000 at allianz, so as I tried to point out selling more tickets than the combined capacity of themselves and their opponents is decent. After that you have to attract neutrals - and for that price is key. Why should a quins fan pay £35 when they can watch on TV? Why shoudl a non-rugby fan, and lets face it rugby is a minority sport, pay out a small fortune for them and their family?

For the less than the cost of a single ticket, you can get a family ticket when Sarries do the pricing. There just are not enough people willing to go.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:Tickets sold has nothing to do with price. Its just that Sarries don't have a large fan bas. There were far more Ulster fans than Saracens in the QF.

Actually both points are true and not mutually exclusive. Sarries can regularly attract 10k fans. To sell out a stadium this size (which they have done on several occasions) they need to set the price so that non-fans are willing to go. ERC declined to do this. Not a surprise as ERC are incable of organising a pissup in a brewery or an orgy in a brothel.

Ye fair enough LT. I'm sure the ERC are regretting it now.

Saracens barely know what a true home game is.

The size of the crowd on yet another different field will barely register on the players.

Sarries by >30.

LondonTiger wrote:[.........Not a surprise as ERC are incable of organising.............an orgy in a brothel.

I know people who can help with this........

Organisation is, I assume, the least desired thing in an orgy?

SecretFly wrote:Organisation is, I assume, the least desired thing in an orgy?

If the ERC tried to organise one, you would have 30 randy men and no women

The Lions team?

God Help Australia!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LondonTiger wrote:

LeinsterFan4life wrote:Tickets sold has nothing to do with price. Its just that Sarries don't have a large fan bas. There were far more Ulster fans than Saracens in the QF.

Actually both points are true and not mutually exclusive. Sarries can regularly attract 10k fans. To sell out a stadium this size (which they have done on several occasions) they need to set the price so that non-fans are willing to go. ERC declined to do this. Not a surprise as ERC are incable of organising a pissup in a brewery or an orgy in a brothel.

If by a 'stadium this size' you mean Twickenham, then I beg to differ. Sarries have used Wembley several times, and have got over 40k each time; but not much more.

But as has been pointed out, Sarries were in charge of pricing.

Quins have practically sold out Twickenham for each of their Big Games. I've been to all of them as a neutral because the price was right - £20-£25.

I can't help thinking that Stadium MK would have been a better venue, but if ERC are setting the prices, it's largely irrelevant.

+ Sarries don't really have 'bandwagon' fans.

Bit of a hiding for Toulon.
Saracens best team in the Avivva and cup by far !

Hound of Harrow wrote:If by a 'stadium this size' you mean Twickenham, then I beg to differ. Sarries have used Wembley several times, and have got over 40k each time; but not much more.

But as has been pointed out, Sarries were in charge of pricing.

Quins have practically sold out Twickenham for each of their Big Games. I've been to all of them as a neutral because the price was right - £20-£25.

I can't help thinking that Stadium MK would have been a better venue, but if ERC are setting the prices, it's largely irrelevant.

They did get almost 84,000 last season when hosting Quins, I think, at Wembley, but yes you are right I may have overegged their ability to fill Wembley.
The first Big Game (against Tigers, Boxing Day 2008 I think, was restricted to two tiers.

Sarries palpably do not have the fans to make putting this match at Twickenham a good idea unless the pricing was right. It wasn't. I agree Stadium MK woul dhave made more sense from capacity reasons, but there may have been other reasons it was not considered.

Matt Stevens is a penalty machine both in the scrum and at the breakdown.

Is this the live match thread? Seems very quiet on here.

9-12 five out from HT. Toulon probably had the better start but Sarries getting more adventurous now.

Toulon the better team, dull game, Kelly Brown laying down his marker for the lions.

I think Saracens will in some ways be happier than Toulon going into the dressing room here. Toulon have been on top, but only lead by 3. Sarries will feel if they can step up a gear they can win this second half.

For me this match is just showing why neither Farrell or Wilkinson should tour. The Lions will need to offer more in attack.

As for this match, Toulon to get a try or two in the next half, they've just looked that bit more dangerous, otherwise I expect much more in the way of penalties being traded

anyone got a link?

nathan wrote:anyone got a link?

do younot save things in favourites? You got a PM

TJ wrote:

nathan wrote:anyone got a link?

do younot save things in favourites? You got a PM

no, i'm usually at home and have no need for these websites. ta for the link.

Would much rather see a Clermont-Sarries Final. Nice to see Michael Lynagh in the box again... we don't hear him comment much over here. As Ozzy says, this game needs a change of gears and a try or two to light things up a bit more.

Both defences on top so far, apart from Giteau's sublime pass to Palisson away early on. One thing with Sarries is that they are a very patient team, and I felt they were getting on top in the last 15.

The atmosphere at the ground leaves something to be desired.

Good arvo, Hound.

Where is everybody? Are there a few football matches on at the same time or are people just getting outdoors doing other things if it's a nice day?

Linebreaker wrote:Good arvo, Hound.

Where is everybody? Are there a few football matches on at the same time or are people just getting outdoors doing other things if it's a nice day?

I think everyone is out celebrating Ed Balls Day..!

Hmm, that post took a while to get through.

Hiya Lb - yeah, there probably is a few footy games on.

There's 3 guys behind us in the puv having a 'Jonny luv in'.

Yellow for Roussow!

ha ha.
This match ain't worth the Lego yet, is it GL?
You'd have to get a special light-blonde piece for Jonny's ageing eyebrows... too hard!

Like the Marie Celeste on this thread....

So it's Sarries 9 - 15 Toulon at about 50 minutes?

Anyone watching it? Anyone look like scoring one of these try thingys?

Edit: 12-15 now and Roussow's just been carded for Toulon. Now there's the real danger this might get interesting.

That was such a weak yellow card it's unreal. This ref is killing the game off.

missed it, what did the Toulon player get binned for?

Rolland is such a killjoy.... You know where I'd like to stick that bloody whistle!

Elaine Rolland

Hell that was a poor pass by Farrell

"Owen Farrell can be relied on he's a pressure player never makes mistakes should start for Lions"

That was one of the worst passes I've ever seen from a 10.

Was it forward or wasn't it?? My God, guys, let the players make their own interesting game, let's not ask the ref to turn it into a game for them.

nathan wrote:missed it, what did the Toulon player get binned for?

A very soft 'high tackle'

Roussow grabbed him round chest, arm rode up, but he released as soon as it looked dangerous.

nathan wrote:missed it, what did the Toulon player get binned for?

second high tackle - fair enough to me

Looseheaded wrote:"Owen Farrell can be relied on he's a pressure player never makes mistakes should start for Lions"

That was one of the worst passes I've ever seen from a 10.

I really don't think he should go. Unless we play to play like Saracens. In which case, you can pick whoever you want because I'll be too busy getting into the All Blacks versus France too care!

Notch wrote:

Looseheaded wrote:"Owen Farrell can be relied on he's a pressure player never makes mistakes should start for Lions"

That was one of the worst passes I've ever seen from a 10.

I really don't think he should go. Unless we play to play like Saracens. In which case, you can pick whoever you want because I'll be too busy getting into the All Blacks versus France too care!

you can still enjoy the way the Ozzies will play.

I think Farrell needs to go - but only as backup / closer / dirttracker to Sexton. Who else? Priestland is flakey, Biggar as dull, Wilko is just an old Farrell

I must admit, I have never heard any commentator wetting himself so much over a kick.

Great passing skills by Saracens.

So you think it would be a political appointment, Notch?

Barritt has limped off... didn't look too serious. Wilko lining up a 51 m kick... and over it goes. 12-18, 56'

johnny > farrell.

with no stand out flyhalfs from the 6n, i'd take johnny.