2013 season discussion thread!

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

First topic message reminder :

Thought I would set up a place where we can discuss the 2013 season!

A good win for Cavendish yesterday in his first race with his new team

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Chris Froome has won the Criterium International

[JDizzle]

With Richie Porte second. Froome is looking stronger and stronger for the TdF. He's going to have probably an even better team than Wiggo did last year behind him, can't wait.

Sagan won the Gent-Wevelgem as well.

[KiaRose]

And Dan Martin won the Volta a Catalunya.

I reckon he is a very promising rider.

[dummy_half]

Most impressive rides of this week:
Cancellara at Harelbeke, soloing for the win ahead of a very strong chase group.

Froome and Porte at Criterium International, with Froome in particular just blowing the other climbers into the weeds. Slightly odd tactics though from Sky in letting one of their riders attacking their other guy who was already the race leader.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Good win for Cav today in stage 2 of Three days of De Panne (something like that)

Sagan took an imperious win yesterday

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Well this sunday is Paris-Roubaix, bar the TDF my fav race of the season!

Cancellara won the Tour of Flanders last Sunday, he's gotta be the fav for this again

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Cancellara takes Paris-Roubaix, after a sprint with Seb Vanmarcke!

Brilliant racing!

Not a good day for the British, with Thomas and Stannard not anywhere to be seen really

[Lumbering_Jack]

Highlights on ITV4 now. Some terrific riding.

[Lumbering_Jack]

Not sure I see the point of the cobbles though. Perhaps because I won't take my in anything other than the smooth.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Highlights on ITV4 now. Some terrific riding.

Stybar was immense. So unlucky though, he was the only one who went with Cancellara when he attacked, none of the big names could handle it

[Lumbering_Jack]

Agree. Not sure if he is to blame or the spectator. Either way was very unlucky.

Average of 27mph... I averaged 20mph in a group this weekend over 50miles of smooth Tarmac. Little way to go before I hit tho pro circuit.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Just a bit Jack!

It's 50/50 I think, the riders know there is a danger when riding down the side rather than the middle, but then the spectator needs to be wary

[dummy_half]

You always need a little luck to win in Roubaix - a badly timed puncture or getting involved in someone elses crash (as happened to Geraint Thomas) can leave you too far off the pace.

Cancellara has really been back at his super-strong best this spring - there really is no-one who can ride a bike as quickly over a distance on flat (or reasonably flattish) terrain.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Sagan won an important race today (I'm not even going to attempt to spell it!)

Really has become a force to be reckoned with this season

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Krueziger wins Amstel Gold, brilliant ride.

Gilbert and co left it too late

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Yes Dan Martin!!!! What a win, as he takes Liege-Bastogne-Liege!!

[JDizzle]

Dan Martin.

[dummy_half]

Dan Martin.

Fantastic win from England's finest .

Was clearly in good form at Fleche Wallonne, but was compromised by a puncture with about 20km to go, and didn't get his positioning right at the start of the finishing climb (had to come round too many fading riders near the top) - ended up 4th and missed the podium by a rim width. This though was a fantastic results - he's described it as an easy win, in that the tactics worked out perfectly for him courtesy of Hejsdal's efforts.

And so ends the Classics phase of the season. Maybe not the most memorable ever, although Cancellara's form in Flanders / Roubaix was sensational.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Team Sky squad for the Giro confirmed:

Wiggins
Cataldo
Henao
Knees
Pate
Puccio
Siutsou
Uran
Zandio

That's pretty strong I think but at the same time means Froome should still have the likes of Kiryienka and Porte at his service for the Tour. Knees in particular is a good addition there - everyone will mention the Columbians but Knees is a workhorse.

Also Petacchi retired

[Big]

There are some pretty handy riders in that bunch. I'm looking forward to seeing how he does now.

[JDizzle]

First off, great win for Froome at the Tour of Romandie. The last two winners of Romandie (Evans and Wiggins) have gone on to win the Tour so it all bodes well.

The thing that bodes not so well is Wiggo coming out with that he feels Sky shouldn't decide the team leader for the Tour until a few days before until they see who is in the best shape. Now I can see why he wouldn't want to give up his title without a fight but we saw at the Vuelta in 2011 what happens when you don't know who your team leader should be. And to complicate matters Froome issues a statement saying that Sky have told him he is team leader. Please don't let this derail your Tour bid boys, a Wiggo-Froome Giro-TdF double would be superb.

And thirdly, this: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-22353145

Good news, but destroying the blood bags?! Really?

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Froome is going to be the leader at TDF no doubt in mind.

That Puerto stuff is just ridiculous Dizzle. Total #headsgone

[JDizzle]

I just hope they make sure Wiggo knows that...

And it's mental. Those bags could blow doping scandals across a lot of sports, not just cycling, wide open. Mental. Absolutely mental.

[LastDamnation]

Gotta protect their national heroes LOL

[Big]

Sad but true LastDamnation... the only defence I could make is that doping wasn't a crime at the time in Spain. Not sure they could legally hand the samples about for anything other than a criminal investigation by the police. I do think the authorities could be open about what they've found and who's implicated though.

[dummy_half]

It's not that unusual for teams with two strong leaders to let both race for the win in the Tour - it usually becomes pretty obvious after the first serious stages who is in the better shape to challenge.

As for the Fuentes case, you have to remember that this case was about the law and medical malpractice, not about doping (which while against sporting rules was not at the time against Spanish common law). On a pure point of law the judge may be entirely correct in her ruling that the blood bags are not to be investigated further by any third party outside the Spanish judicial system.

Does rather smell like a cover up though, and I'm fed up of the reporting that keeps referring to cycling when we know that the sports being protected are much higher profile (football, tennis, athletics).

[Mike Selig]

I would actually quite like both Froome and Wiggins go for the Tour. I suggest so would everyone else if they weren't British. If Sky backs one of them fully and gives them the team they're capable of then I fear this year's tour will be another snoozefest, following the USP/Disc template. It may be great to have a British winner, but for me not at the expense of a decent interesting race; but then I don't really support people "by country" in individual sports in general (tennis for example I will support Federer over everyone).

Regarding Fuentes I agree with everyone. It would be very interesting to see what skeletons are in all the other sports cupboards. Perhaps some people who turn their noses up at cycling's doping history would eat a bit of humble pie then.

Whilst we're on that subject, am I the only one slightly concerned by Sky's total domination of Tour events at the moment? I know they've also got the strongest personnel/technology/set-up, but... The one thing which eases my doubt is we're not seeing the average speeds we used to, and visually we're not seeing people sprint up mountains.

[dummy_half]

Mike

I still find it very difficult to think of Froome as a British rider - he started his career riding under the Kenyan flag, it being the country of his birth (he was raised partly there and partly in South Africa). Racing under a British licence is really a bit of a 'flag of convenience', and I think was mainly to help him in his Olympic preparations, keeping access to Brailsford and British Cycling.

As for Sky's domination of stage racing, it does make you wonder what they are doing differently from everyone else - hopefully it is all above board and they are just doing a better job of getting riders to races in the best possible ahape and then utilising their riding resources smartly. However the USPostal-like domination certainly raises eye brows, as does the improvement of certain riders (Froome being the main one).

[Mike Selig]

To be fair about Froome, everyone you talk to no matter what nationality agree that he's always had this kind of potential. A bit like Hamilton. Erm... ok not the best example (but had all the field been clean Hamilton would have done very well, despite being a late bloomer, so if all the field is mostly clean then I can believe Froome's improvement on its own).

Reading between the lines the French sports paper l'Equipe is certainly suspicious of the set-up at Sky, but part of that is their Mail-like tendancy to be suspicious of anybody doing well who's not French. On the other hand, they called a few high profile cases early (Armstrong being the obvious one - in spite of what the Sunday Times would have you believe David Walsh wasn't the only journalist who had a go).

Going back to the point about nationality, I'm not really fussed. I just think it would be a shame if what are IMO 2 of the best 3 GT riders (Contador being the other one) should choose not to compete.

[dummy_half]

Mike

It is definitely a shame for the sport that at the moment two of perhaps 4 or 5 credible Grand Tour challengers are on the same team, and both are of nationalities that puts their main focus on the Tour.

Last year's Tour may have been an excellent win by Wiggins, but it was a hellish dull race - top 2 being on the same team, and the stronger ITT rider winning does not make for much excitement. Maybe if Wiggins and Froome weren't team mates we'd have seen who was the more worthy winner.

[JDizzle]

I just like both Wiggins and Froome. I'd love to see them race against each other on opposing teams but I really don't want to see them race against each other on the same team and end up with them both losing out on victory when it was there for the taking. I can see exactly why people would prefer them to go at it though as last years Tour was pretty dull.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Gotta protect their national heroes LOL

Sadly it is true.

I just hope WADA can get there hands on the bags before they're destroyed.

Cycling gets tarnished with the doping stereotype, but that's only because they find the people doping, and are actually doing something about it.

I'd imagine there are a fair few footballers, tennis players and athletes praying those bags get destroyed

[whocares]

What do you guys make of Wiggins chance in the Giro? Compared to last year, he had a rather slow start this season (5th in the catalunia and trentin tours with no stage win). Of course the coming giro is maybe more designed for him (two ITTs and less mountains arrivals) but its still a tough exercise. The likes of Nibali seem to have peaked earlier as well. It is not clear yet wether or not he will compete in the tour de france and he mentionned on monday that he would do both giro and tour de france. Froome on the other hand as ticked all the boxes when it comes to a smooth and successful TDF preparation (victory at the tour of Romandie like both previous TDF winners).

[dummy_half]

whocares

I'm not too concerned by Wiggins's form - he's been climbing very well in the last couple of races, but just hasn't gone all-out for the overall win.

The Giro is typically a very different race from the Tour - traditionally a more attacking and climbing race, with tough stages scattered throughout the race (because of the geography of Italy - hilly or mountainous in most areas). It tends to be a much harder race to control than the Tour de France because of the number of opportunities it gives the climbers.

You wouldn't necessarily think that it suited Wiggins as an ITT specialist and steady paced climber, and there is also the issue of the Italians peaking for the Giro. However, Wiggins is a class rider and the course does include an unusually long flattish ITT at the end of the first week - if Wiggins is on form he should be able to establish a good lead for the pink jersey after this stage and then ride more defensively while the challengers have to attack.

Personally, I don't think he'll win (he'll lose too much time to a specialist climber in one of the mountain stages - probably end up 3rd or so), but it's going to be interesting seeing how he goes.

[djlovesyou]

I can't see who can stop him besides Nibali though, and Nibali has never shown himself to be strong enough to just ride away from Wiggins (and what will be a super strong train with the Colombians both doing their job on the mountains.)

Hejsedal is a big unknown this year, but I can't imagine his form is that good despite a decent LBL.

Who else have we got?

Samu Sanchez - always a good bet for podium but shown very little relevant forum this year.

Gesink - No chance, will get dropped early, or fall, but probably both.

Scarponi - Always strong here, and in decent form. Strong enough to attack the SKY train though?

Cadel - I'll eat my hat.

Santambrogio - In awesome form, for him, may not challenge for the win but should be the BMC leader. Could podium?

Pozzovivo - So cute, and will win a stage or two. Will lose dozens of minutes in the TTs and will probably fall at some stage too.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Nibali's got a pretty strong team behind him too tbf.

Plus with the Giro there are some fierce descents that Nibali will thrive on.

It's too close to call in my mind. I'll say Nibali

[djlovesyou]

He has got a strong team, but it's not as strong as SKY and he'll have to play catch-up which is always difficult.

Wiggins could have a 2 minute lead by the end of the first week. Will be tough to claw that back.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Well if Wiggins gets a large lead, it'll certainly make for better racing, with the others needing to attack on climbs/descents.

I do think the Giro provides the best racing out of the three Grand Tours.

I remember Evans/Basso battling up the Zoncalon in (2010?). What a climb that is

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Good win for Cav yesterday!

Team time trial today, gotta fancy Sky really

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

http://www1.skysports.com/cycling/news/15264/8695394/Sir-Dave-Brailsford-says-Chris-Froome-will-lead-Tea-Sky-at-Tour-de-France

Froome confirmed as leader of Team Sky at the TDF

[dummy_half]

Interesting Giro stage yesterday - Sky lost the jersey, but that's no bad thing considering it was to Paolini who is a strong classics type rider and who might be able to hold on for a couple of days but is not threat overall.

More interesting was that Heysdal and Nibali were very active on the last climb and particularly the descent, putting lots of the lesser conternders in trouble. Ended up with Pozzovivo losing 35 seconds to the main contenders and Scarponi 45s after crashing on the final descent. Not huge changes in the long run, but likely to affect the race dynamics over the next few days.

[dummy_half]

A stage yesterday that shows why the Giro is a better race than the Tour - a shortish but steep cat 3 climb about 20km from the finish (after a flattish stage) saw Cav (and a couple of other sprinters) struggling to keep with the peloton - came so close to managing it, but the last 300m were particularly steep and saw him swing off the back and summit about 1 minute behind. A chase back on the short descent and flat saw his small group within sight of the back of the peloton but then a further short but steep ramp was just too much, leaving him 45s behind with 7km to go - eventually they gave it away and roll through 6 minutes down in the end.

This left Argos Shimano as the team with the best sprinter in the lead group (Degenkolb), but their and everyone elses lead out was catastrophically disrupted at the last corner about 800m from the finish - their lead-out guy (riding second in the peloton) crashed on the corner exit on a wet road and zebra crossing. This left the guy who had been first round the last corner with a big gap (maybe 100m) as he was the only one who hadn't had to slow down because of the fall. Degenkolb chased hard alone and was just strong enough to get there in the end.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

I was so gutted for the guy in Green Dummy, his legs just went bang with about 350m to go

[dummy_half]

I was so gutted for the guy in Green Dummy, his legs just went bang with about 350m to go

He was trying so hard to make the most of the unexpected opportunity. Pity that it was a slightly draggy finish, as I reckon had it been slightly downhill he'd have made it.

[Azabache]

Going back to the Wiggins/Froome debate, a little stress-a la Hinault/LeMond-on the same team is no bad thing particularly as there is this nagging doubt about Froome's "moral fibre" in the big tours-witness his stitch-up in last year's Vuelta.

I'm not saying that he's in the David Millar moaning category, but a doubt remains...

I'd love him to win the Tour, but, but.......

[Mad for Chelsea]

textbook from Omega today: got the lead-out spot on and Cavendish duly delivers with a fairly comfortable win by a bike length. Cavendish clearly delighted with his teammates work today, they haven't always got the lead-out right so far but signs they may be coming together, which doesn't bode well for the other sprinters out there...

[djlovesyou]

They'll be back to 'needing a good talking to and an embarrassment' next time he doesn't win one.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Today's stage is ridiculously treacherous

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Bike change and a crash (which Eurosport haven't reported at all) have killed Wiggins's chances of pulling back huge amounts today.

Dowsett could win the stage

[Lowlandbrit]

Big win for Dowsett, Wiggins just doesn't look as sharp as last year.

[Sponsored content]