Chavez Jr vs Vera now being contested at 173lbs!!!!!!!!

http://espn.go.com/blog/dan-rafael/post/_/id/5655/chavez-remains-reigning-king-of-drama

Seriously, how can anyone be a fan of this guy.

Handed a title on a silver plate, failing drugs tests, skipping drugs tests, fighting bums, robbing opponents (Zbik) and just being a fat useless waste of space.

The original agreement was 168lbs and guess what!? Yep, Chavez is struggling to make weight.

He has left Roach, Ariza etc and is now with his dad training. Great call  

Lets face it, the guy is toast if he is going to try and compete against fellow 175lb'ers

Its all well and good being a cruiserweight on the night against Andy Lee. But this guy struggled with average fighters like Zbik, Rubio and Billy Lyell and couldn't take them out dispite being about 4 divisions heavier.

Would love to see this blow up in his face and for Vera to win (although unlikely in every possible way, especially as the judges will be friends of daddy).

Thoughts?

Thoughts............you're not to keen on Chavez Jr.


Jr is a cash cow. Cash cows get what they want. When he does get truly found out it's going to be rough for him.

He is lazy and uncommitted.

He already got found out Strongy

If he fights 175ers he will be taken to pieces, love to see Adonis land that left on him.

He wont fight Stevenson at 175, he isnt that stupid!

Believe me Raf I know! Love to see it though!

If he's weighin in at 173, what bloody weight is he actually going to be on fight night!!??

He looked super fat in the last picture i saw of him.

Yea apparrantly well north of 200lbs.

Will be glad to see the back of him tbh, offers nothing to the sport apart from being fed with a silver spoon due to daddys friends.

Chavez is a big, fat bum. can't stand him. The way Top Rank and the WBC have manouvered him is a disgrace to the sport

You wouldn't have minded if it was someone who was charismatic or had skill.

But the guy was/is just a huge guy who can take a punch and give one back. No speed, head movement, foot movement etc.

Just lumbers forward and uses his extra 2 stone to push people against the ropes.

He will probably rehydrate close to 200lbs

Useless bum, very little talent and no discipline, but is massive with quick hands and a good chin

Massive
quick hands
good chin


Sounds like a reasonable talent set to me... I believe the term youre looking for is very little skill

And the no discipline

Just to cheese off Reborn even more, the latest news is that they are going to weight Chavez privately and then depending on his weight, they will decide on the weight for the fight.

So it could be higher than the agreed 173.....

Chavez is going to lose Saturday... Vera has wom four straight, including a win over Mora. He isnt Martinez, but I suspect judges will be working overtime to keep Chavez once-defeated

Ive generally found 30/1 for the draw, this being the 25th, I might put my months salary, and sleep safe in the knowledge that Im buying a Ferrari next Monday

BoxingFan88 wrote:Just to cheese off Reborn even more, the latest news is that they are going to weight Chavez privately and then depending on his weight, they will decide on the weight for the fight.

So it could be higher than the agreed 173.....

Ggggggrrrr      

http://espn.go.com/blog/dan-rafael/post/_/id/5685/arum-wait-for-the-weight

 

What an absolute joke!!!!!!

What a professional.

How ridiculous

Vera will probably weigh less than 173lbs on the night, and Chavez could be 200lbs from the sounds of it

I hope Vera hits his body early and hard as Jr is bound to be fleshy if he is as big as he sounds and has stamina problems anyway

I've never wanted a fighter to win so bad that I don't really care about or know

Everyone here is going to be shocked when I post pictures of my 458 on Monday due to my winnings! Chavez has a granite chin, he isnt going to get KO'd, but I think Vera will dominate, and thus, get the draw!

I'll not be shocked. I did a thread a month or two ago when this fight was announced saying I think Vera could take this.

Weight issues, leaving Roach, leaving Ariza, not committed, ring rust etc could be a factor.

The only thing that worries me is the fact that against Zbik, Chavez got out landed, out smarted and out fought and still had his arm raised. So Vera will need a KO to win this fight.

Things like this just make boxing look ridiculous. But controversy sells I guess. I already want to see him in the ring with Groves or Froch.

So it would seem the contest will be 173....with the added stipulation that it now becomes a 10 Round Fight...which is supposed to give Vera an advantage as it means Chavez will have to start off quicker than usual? Hmmm not sure I buy into that...if anything they have taken away any stamina issues that may have arisen for the Mexican.

Either way this fight is a laughing stock, well actually I will rephrase that...Chavez and Arum are a laughing stock. It's an embarrassment that this contest is being allowed to go ahead. The dangers are their for everyone to see...what's it going to take for people to see that allowing such contests to go ahead is plain wrong...someone dying I would imagine!

Vera could be outweighed by something like 40 pounds come fight night and whilst it is all well and good saying well he could no and call it off, the fact is his hands are pretty  much tied. Should he walk away from the fight I would guarantee he wouldn't be allowed anywhere near a World Title fight/Big Money fight ever again....the snakes around the sport would make sure of that.

This is the problem with this sport we love so much....anytime that the candle begins to burn brightly again...those involved do their damn best to blow it out and undo all the hard work!

Link: http://www.eastsideboxing.com/2013/julio-cesar-chavez-jr-and-bryan-vera-agree-to-173-pound-weight-limit-and-10-round-contest/

Not the most reliable I know, but news is breaking on plenty more sources/websites as we speak!

That genuinely is a joke, theres catchweights and now a Chavez Jr weight, essentially whatever he feels like turning up at.

They should make weigh ins the morning of the fight.

catchweight wrote:They should make weigh ins the morning of the fight.

Na, you'll just get people dehydrated while fighting, more dangerous than being outweighed a few pounds.

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:They should make weigh ins the morning of the fight.

Na, you'll just get people dehydrated while fighting, more dangerous than being outweighed a few pounds.

If they cant make a weight class they shouldnt fight in it. The point of day before weigh in wasnt to allow fighters to exploit the system and pile on 10 or 15 pounds before a fight. There wasnt much wrong with the old system. There are enough weight classes now that fighters really shouldnt have to be dehydrating badly to make a limit. I think its ridiculous a fighter can weigh in for a fight supposed to be at one limit and then the next day when they actual fight happens jump up one or two weight classes more. It encouraging fighters to dehydrate themselves more because they know they can exploit it to gain huge weight advantages.

What about Vera in all this. He is a middleweight fighter.

I hope Arum is covering his McDonald's bills so he can put on 2 stone.

Then after the fight is he going to be stuck at that weight or boil back down and be even worse than he already was!?

catchweight wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:They should make weigh ins the morning of the fight.

Na, you'll just get people dehydrated while fighting, more dangerous than being outweighed a few pounds.

If they cant make a weight class they shouldnt fight in it. The point of day before weigh in wasnt to allow fighters to exploit the system and pile on 10 or 15 pounds before a fight. There wasnt much wrong with the old system. There are enough weight classes now that fighters really shouldnt have to be dehydrating badly to make a limit. I think its ridiculous a fighter can weigh in for a fight supposed to be at one limit and then the next day when they actual fight happens jump up one or two weight classes more. It encouraging fighters to dehydrate themselves more because they know they can exploit it to gain huge weight advantages.

That post doesn't address anything. The main issue is the safety of the fighters and same day weigh ins aren't as safe.

We don't live in an ideal world full of bunnies and kittens when fighters will only fight in the division they 'belong'.

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:They should make weigh ins the morning of the fight.

Na, you'll just get people dehydrated while fighting, more dangerous than being outweighed a few pounds.

If they cant make a weight class they shouldnt fight in it. The point of day before weigh in wasnt to allow fighters to exploit the system and pile on 10 or 15 pounds before a fight. There wasnt much wrong with the old system. There are enough weight classes now that fighters really shouldnt have to be dehydrating badly to make a limit. I think its ridiculous a fighter can weigh in for a fight supposed to be at one limit and then the next day when they actual fight happens jump up one or two weight classes more. It encouraging fighters to dehydrate themselves more because they know they can exploit it to gain huge weight advantages.

That post doesn't address anything. The main issue is the safety of the fighters and same day weigh ins aren't as safe.

We don't live in an ideal world full of bunnies and kittens when fighters will only fight in the division they 'belong'.

No same day weigh ins would be perfectly fine. Its only unsafe if boxers make it unsafe by trying to fight in weight classes they dont belong in. Inexcusable nowadays when there are so many weight classes to fight in.

The purpose of weight classes is to ensure a fair fight. There was theory behind having day before weigh ins, but in practice the system doesnt really work. It encourages fighters to dehydrate themselves more to unnatural levels in order to gain big weight advantages. Its not a good system. You should try watching someone like Adrien Broner demolish a guy way outsized to see how safe and unfair the current system can be in practice.

Boxers should fight in a weight class they are comfortable with making. Not hiring sports scientists armed with various supplements and dehydrating themselves down to unhealthy levels so that they can enjoy a big size advantage over their opponent. I think encouraging a system where boxers fight in a natural weight class is a much more practical solution that wouldnt require the involvements of bunnies and kittens.

catchweight wrote:No same day weigh ins would be perfectly fine. Its only unsafe if boxers make it unsafe by trying to fight in weight classes they dont belong in.

Come back to the real world please.

catchweight wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:They should make weigh ins the morning of the fight.

Na, you'll just get people dehydrated while fighting, more dangerous than being outweighed a few pounds.

If they cant make a weight class they shouldnt fight in it. The point of day before weigh in wasnt to allow fighters to exploit the system and pile on 10 or 15 pounds before a fight. There wasnt much wrong with the old system. There are enough weight classes now that fighters really shouldnt have to be dehydrating badly to make a limit. I think its ridiculous a fighter can weigh in for a fight supposed to be at one limit and then the next day when they actual fight happens jump up one or two weight classes more. It encouraging fighters to dehydrate themselves more because they know they can exploit it to gain huge weight advantages.

That post doesn't address anything. The main issue is the safety of the fighters and same day weigh ins aren't as safe.

We don't live in an ideal world full of bunnies and kittens when fighters will only fight in the division they 'belong'.

No same day weigh ins would be perfectly fine. Its only unsafe if boxers make it unsafe by trying to fight in weight classes they dont belong in. Inexcusable nowadays when there are so many weight classes to fight in.  

The purpose of weight classes is to ensure a fair fight. There was theory behind having day before weigh ins, but in practice the system doesnt really work. It encourages fighters to dehydrate themselves more to unnatural levels in order to gain big weight advantages. Its not a good system. You should try watching someone like Adrien Broner demolish a guy way outsized to see how safe and unfair the current system can be in practice.

Boxers should fight in a weight class they are comfortable with making. Not hiring sports scientists armed with various supplements and dehydrating themselves down to unhealthy levels so that they can enjoy a big size advantage over their opponent. I think encouraging a system where boxers fight in a natural weight class is a much more practical solution that wouldnt require the involvements of bunnies and kittens.

Scott's correct. It's not about dehydration (fighters will dehydrate to make weight regardless of when the weigh-in is) it's about rehydration.

Same day weigh-ins meant that some fighters didn't have enough time to rehydrate fully before the fight. This was considered to be too dangerous. Moving the weigh-in to the day before meant that fighters had enough time to rehydrate fully before getting into the ring.

Chavez' only advantages are ones gained from being larger than his opponents. Cleverly's chin hadn't been cracked until he faced a top puncher, then it got obliterated. A testament to Kov's power more than anything.

Chavez may look to have an iron head against middleweights, but against a full blown light heavy there's no way he's walking through shots. Stevenson or Kovalev could end him in the first. This means he'll have to rely on hit and don't be hit boxing skills, of which he none.

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:No same day weigh ins would be perfectly fine. Its only unsafe if boxers make it unsafe by trying to fight in weight classes they dont belong in.

Come back to the real world please.

Ok

STC wrote:

catchweight wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:They should make weigh ins the morning of the fight.

Na, you'll just get people dehydrated while fighting, more dangerous than being outweighed a few pounds.

If they cant make a weight class they shouldnt fight in it. The point of day before weigh in wasnt to allow fighters to exploit the system and pile on 10 or 15 pounds before a fight. There wasnt much wrong with the old system. There are enough weight classes now that fighters really shouldnt have to be dehydrating badly to make a limit. I think its ridiculous a fighter can weigh in for a fight supposed to be at one limit and then the next day when they actual fight happens jump up one or two weight classes more. It encouraging fighters to dehydrate themselves more because they know they can exploit it to gain huge weight advantages.

That post doesn't address anything. The main issue is the safety of the fighters and same day weigh ins aren't as safe.

We don't live in an ideal world full of bunnies and kittens when fighters will only fight in the division they 'belong'.

No same day weigh ins would be perfectly fine. Its only unsafe if boxers make it unsafe by trying to fight in weight classes they dont belong in. Inexcusable nowadays when there are so many weight classes to fight in.  

The purpose of weight classes is to ensure a fair fight. There was theory behind having day before weigh ins, but in practice the system doesnt really work. It encourages fighters to dehydrate themselves more to unnatural levels in order to gain big weight advantages. Its not a good system. You should try watching someone like Adrien Broner demolish a guy way outsized to see how safe and unfair the current system can be in practice.

Boxers should fight in a weight class they are comfortable with making. Not hiring sports scientists armed with various supplements and dehydrating themselves down to unhealthy levels so that they can enjoy a big size advantage over their opponent. I think encouraging a system where boxers fight in a natural weight class is a much more practical solution that wouldnt require the involvements of bunnies and kittens.

Scott's correct. It's not about dehydration (fighters will dehydrate to make weight regardless of when the weigh-in is) it's about rehydration.

Same day weigh-ins meant that some fighters didn't have enough time to rehydrate fully before the fight. This was considered to be too dangerous. Moving the weigh-in to the day before meant that fighters had enough time to rehydrate fully before getting into the ring.

No its just affording fighters leeway for trying to fight in weight classes they cant compete in. It would be fine if they were given time to rehydrate and they were a few pounds above their limit but thats not what is happening in practice. Boxers are exploiting it to dehydrate themselves as much as possible so that they can enjoy big size gains in the ring. And then using the argument that they need that rehydration period for safety. If you need to be putting on 10, 15, 20 pounds overnight to compete properly then you arent in that weight class. Instead of condoning that the focus should be on getting fighters to compete in proper weight classes without going to extreme measures.

catchweight wrote:No its just affording fighters leeway for trying to fight in weight classes they cant compete in. It would be fine if they were given time to rehydrate and they were a few pounds above their limit but thats not what is happening in practice. Boxers are exploiting it to dehydrate themselves as much as possible so that they can enjoy big size gains in the ring. And then using the argument that they need that rehydration period for safety. If you need to be putting on 10, 15, 20 pounds overnight to compete properly then you arent in that weight class. Instead of condoning that the focus should be on getting fighters to compete in proper weight classes without going to extreme measures.

Fine. Ideas?

John Bloody Wayne wrote:Chavez' only advantages are ones gained from being larger than his opponents. Cleverly's chin hadn't been cracked until he faced a top puncher, then it got obliterated. A testament to Kov's power more than anything.

Chavez may look to have an iron head against middleweights, but against a full blown light heavy there's no way he's walking through shots. Stevenson or Kovalev could end him in the first. This means he'll have to rely on hit and don't be hit boxing skills, of which he none.

Yea but he is fighting another middleweight forced to move up to light heavy.

Maybe thats the new strategy from Arum....get c-level middleweights to move up 2 weight divisions to fight Chavez.

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:No its just affording fighters leeway for trying to fight in weight classes they cant compete in. It would be fine if they were given time to rehydrate and they were a few pounds above their limit but thats not what is happening in practice. Boxers are exploiting it to dehydrate themselves as much as possible so that they can enjoy big size gains in the ring. And then using the argument that they need that rehydration period for safety. If you need to be putting on 10, 15, 20 pounds overnight to compete properly then you arent in that weight class. Instead of condoning that the focus should be on getting fighters to compete in proper weight classes without going to extreme measures.

Fine. Ideas?

Limit the amount they can rehydrate above each weight class limit and make boxers responsible for making weight healthily. If you have to pack on huge amounts of weight overnight then sorry, your bumped into a different weight. For example - lightweight weigh in limit 135lb, lightweight fight night weight limit 138lb. If you need more than that, you arent a light weight and should be in another class that is more suitable.

catchweight wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:No its just affording fighters leeway for trying to fight in weight classes they cant compete in. It would be fine if they were given time to rehydrate and they were a few pounds above their limit but thats not what is happening in practice. Boxers are exploiting it to dehydrate themselves as much as possible so that they can enjoy big size gains in the ring. And then using the argument that they need that rehydration period for safety. If you need to be putting on 10, 15, 20 pounds overnight to compete properly then you arent in that weight class. Instead of condoning that the focus should be on getting fighters to compete in proper weight classes without going to extreme measures.

Fine. Ideas?

Limit the amount they can rehydrate above each weight class limit and make boxers responsible for making weight healthily. If you have to pack on huge amounts of weight overnight then sorry, your bumped into a different weight. For example - lightweight weigh in limit 135lb, lightweight fight night weight limit 138lb. If you need more than that, you arent a light weight and should be in another class that is more suitable.

Doesn't solve the problem of boxers coming into the ring dehydrated.

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

catchweight wrote:No its just affording fighters leeway for trying to fight in weight classes they cant compete in. It would be fine if they were given time to rehydrate and they were a few pounds above their limit but thats not what is happening in practice. Boxers are exploiting it to dehydrate themselves as much as possible so that they can enjoy big size gains in the ring. And then using the argument that they need that rehydration period for safety. If you need to be putting on 10, 15, 20 pounds overnight to compete properly then you arent in that weight class. Instead of condoning that the focus should be on getting fighters to compete in proper weight classes without going to extreme measures.

Fine. Ideas?

Limit the amount they can rehydrate above each weight class limit and make boxers responsible for making weight healthily. If you have to pack on huge amounts of weight overnight then sorry, your bumped into a different weight. For example - lightweight weigh in limit 135lb, lightweight fight night weight limit 138lb. If you need more than that, you arent a light weight and should be in another class that is more suitable.

Doesn't solve the problem of boxers coming into the ring dehydrated.

Well it should because it gives a margin for rehydration where boxers might struggle to make weight and outside of that it spells out clearly that there is not scope allowed for major dehydration and rehydration. The boxers need to have responsibility for making weight properly by figuring out that if they have to badly dehydrate themselves to make a limit then they shouldnt be fighting in that weight class. Its their choice. Its unfair to punish boxers who do fight according to their natural weight classes to allow others can come along and clearly exploit the system well beyond what was intended and find themselves having to fight an opponent that belongs one or more weight classes above. What you weigh on the night is completely relevant. If a lightweight fights as a lightweight at the lightweight limit he should not expect to have to fight a welterweight in the ring.

It may be 'unfair', but it's better than any plan which involves limiting fight night weights.

I dont think it is. I think requiring a bit practical sense from boxers regarding dehydration is not too much ask. If you cant make a weight limit properly, just dont fight there.

Yeah, but we know that doesn't happen, so what's the point in repeating it?

Doesn't happen, wont happen, not worth considering.

Scottrf wrote:Yeah, but we know that doesn't happen, so what's the point in repeating it?

Doesn't happen, wont happen, not worth considering.

Sorry but that is BS. Before the current system the vast majority boxers were able to cope fine. It was taken as a precautionary measure and for promoters to profit off making it a big publicity occasion. You would swear every boxer in history was coming in like Chavez Jr at a weigh in the way you go on. Most boxers fought well within their capabilities because they were smart enough to figure that coming in severely dehydrated was no advantage.

Chavez definitely has a good chin, but Martinez' power got to him and forced him to retreat so going up to 168 or 175 will probably end barely

His chin can't get any better, and if he gets hit as often as he did at MW then he's in trouble. Walking through Lee, Manfredo and Zbik (who I still think beat him) doesn't mean anything against the best light heavies

He's lucky Vera is a small middle and not a one punch KO artist

catchweight wrote:Sorry but that is BS.

If you say so. Not gonna happen though.