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Djokovich is a graceless winner

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Jahu
Josiah Maiestas
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Post by Guest Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 14:51

"If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster and treat those two impostors just the same"

Novak Djokovic it seems, whilst embracing the latter, has forgone the former.

In Victory it appears that the real Novak steps forward: arrogant, crude, tribal and classless.

Once the perpetual bridesmade, but now the bride, the spoils of victory have done little to endear the Serbian to the sporting fraternity.

Who can forget the celebrations after defeating Nadal in Rome; the gluttural roaring, chest thumping and neanderthal posturing?

Or the wildly over the top jubilation at winning the tie break against Dolgopolov at this year's USO?

How about the sarcastic tapping of the frame of his racket after a Federer winner whizzed passed him in the semi-final?

Of course Djokovic is a product of his environment.

Did his mother not declare that 'The king is dead' after his 2008 AUS victory over RF?

She even took to twitter to announce that it's now 'Nole, Nole, Nole' after his W 2011 victory (in reference to the previous oft heard media speak of Roger and Rafa).

Oh, and who can forget the wild, drunken, crass celebrations following that W victory? Driving around in a car with a motley crew, flag waving, horn blowing, intoxicated dancing. Really Djokovic?

Djokovic may have learnt to be a gracious loser (well, he had plenty of practice at that) but he certainly hasn't learnt the art of winning gracefully.

ghost

emancipator - good and evil lies in all men; we try to encourage the former and forgive the latter.


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Post by droogle Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:01

Grace is an act anyways, at least in the context of professional sport.

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Post by socal1976 Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:09

You are free to your opinion but you are wrong. I don't remember any of his celebrations being beyond the average on the ATP tour. Players do show emotion, at least he doesn't trash his opponents in the media, he just shows his happiness and keeps the negative comments to himself. If you have a problem with his mother and his countrymen then that is not really under his control.

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Post by Manojchandra Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:10

I am no Nole fan, but I do not feel so. I think we shouldn't compare him with statesmen like RF or RN. He has had to be like this to stand out to break the stranglehold. I recall him taking a stance when he challenged RF's stay at top. Was it W 2008? I also recall how gracious he was in acknowledging RF, RN at his various defeats.

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Post by break_in_the_fifth Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:17

Unless this article is meant to be imitating others that meticulously look for faults in other players on or off court, I would say Djokovic like any of the other pros has trained his whole life for those moments and so is entitled to celebrate like he has.

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Post by barrystar Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:18

Whenever I have watched Djokovic live I have always thought his on-court conduct to be very good. Mind you, I've not seen him in a tense match against one of the top players.

I think that the OP is a bit of bait on a hook and not really worth taking in the way intended.
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Post by Guest Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:26

break_in_the_fifth wrote:Unless this article is meant to be imitating others that meticulously look for faults in other players on or off court, I would say Djokovic like any of the other pros has trained his whole life for those moments and so is entitled to celebrate like he has.

Yes.. that is exactly the point I was trying to make.

It is very easy to find faults in other people if one sets out looking for them.

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Post by legendkillar Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:36

Not sure I agree with that.

I actually admired his celebration in Rome of one of to say 'Here I am and I am here to stay'

I don't like the whole treat a victory like it is a massive achievement. Understandable with lesser ranked players who have no desire or nor the talent to compete at the very top.

I have never had a problem with Novak at all with his on court demeanour. Take Federer. To me I like the quiet, un-assuming smiling celebration as he expects to win and you have to love someone who loves the habit of winning. Rafa is different where he tries to have fun and enjoy the moment when victorious.

I remember Roy Keane once saying on the lines of 'I admire Roberto Carlos for all he has achieved in the sport. He gets on with it and puts in a performance week in and week out and doesn't celebrate success as he expects to win'

Each player to their own.

One day I like silence and another day I may like the explosion of raw emotion.

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Post by Josiah Maiestas Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:38

Novak is possibly the type of person who as a child was perhaps quite hyperactive; a show off so to speak, certainly not the type of person to hide away from the limelight.. I tend to agree eman that his reaction to winning the Rome MS was a little bit over the top, falling on the ground like that as if he'd won RG for crying out loud!

I wonder what his celebration could be if he wins tonite...
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Post by Guest Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:42

What do people make of the gun incident?

A picture of Tipsy pointing a gun at Novak, whilst Novak was holding a placard stating 'what would Rafa pay?'

It was posted on Tipsy's facebook account, but taken down once it received a lot of negative comments.

Surely that would count as distasteful?

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Post by barrystar Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:49

emancipator wrote:What do people make of the gun incident?

A picture of Tipsy pointing a gun at Novak, whilst Novak was holding a placard stating 'what would Rafa pay?'

It was posted on Tipsy's facebook account, but taken down once it received a lot of negative comments.

Surely that would count as distasteful?

Silly stuff - but it was Tipsarevic who did it and the trouble with social media is that people often use it clumsily by airing in public a slightly misjudged private matter between friends which ordinarily would pass over and be forgotten. We've all said and done things in the company of friends we can trust that could look horrible to the outside world if made public. Tipsarevic is a bit of a charlie for not realising that this was a bit of horseplay best kept between friends and forgotten.
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Post by barrystar Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:50

And it's almost two months old now as well http://tennis.si.com/2011/07/21/tipsarevic-djokovic-and-a-toy-gun/
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Post by barrystar Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 15:50

emancipator wrote:
break_in_the_fifth wrote:Unless this article is meant to be imitating others that meticulously look for faults in other players on or off court, I would say Djokovic like any of the other pros has trained his whole life for those moments and so is entitled to celebrate like he has.

Yes.. that is exactly the point I was trying to make.

It is very easy to find faults in other people if one sets out looking for them.

OK
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Post by Guest Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 16:02

barrystar wrote:
emancipator wrote:
break_in_the_fifth wrote:Unless this article is meant to be imitating others that meticulously look for faults in other players on or off court, I would say Djokovic like any of the other pros has trained his whole life for those moments and so is entitled to celebrate like he has.

Yes.. that is exactly the point I was trying to make.

It is very easy to find faults in other people if one sets out looking for them.

OK

I agree that all the things that I noted are actually trivial and not worth any real consideration. Personally, I can see beyond all of those things, but this article serves to highlight how easy it is to critisize. Ultimately, it is a question of interpretation based on personal feelings.

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Post by Jahu Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 16:07

Well if it's a questions of interpretation, then I agree with your first post. King-Kong chest pumping and fisting is a totally cheap behavior from him.

And gracious or not, he is one annoying winner or looser.
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Post by Manojchandra Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 16:12

legendkillar wrote:Not sure I agree with that.

I actually admired his celebration in Rome of one of to say 'Here I am and I am here to stay'

I don't like the whole treat a victory like it is a massive achievement. Understandable with lesser ranked players who have no desire or nor the talent to compete at the very top.

I have never had a problem with Novak at all with his on court demeanour. Take Federer. To me I like the quiet, un-assuming smiling celebration as he expects to win and you have to love someone who loves the habit of winning. Rafa is different where he tries to have fun and enjoy the moment when victorious.

I remember Roy Keane once saying on the lines of 'I admire Roberto Carlos for all he has achieved in the sport. He gets on with it and puts in a performance week in and week out and doesn't celebrate success as he expects to win'



Very well put.


Each player to their own.

One day I like silence and another day I may like the explosion of raw emotion.

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Post by Manojchandra Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 16:20

Sorry, forgot to add. I really liked that.

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Post by socal1976 Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 17:26

Yeah, I agree the gun thing with tipsy is a little over the top and in retrospect I am sure Novak realizes it wasn't smart and not a very good idea. Also a bit presumptuous and disrespectful of nadal. As JM says at times Novak is still kind of like a hyperactive kid, its part of his charm but it can and does get him in trouble at times.

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Post by Tom_____ Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 18:01

I think he is a decent winner and ok loser, but i do think he is a bit prone to giving up before others would and i think he dishes out a lot of jokes etc about other but then can't take jokes back - like Roddick dig at the US open whenever it was: the last link here shows a bit of ungraciousness and lack of ability to take an obvious joke imo.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPgWoOon8-w
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o28_Vmt7t-8&feature=related
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVh_d2zmeac&feature=related

I do think this kind of thing is funny though, taking the mickey out of Nadal and ?Shakira? even though you would never see Nadal hit back with something similar.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2iQiliqzv4

and this is just out and out ridiculous:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31f6Ar6DSM0


Last edited by Tom_____ on Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 18:48; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Leff Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 18:27

On the court, Novak is an entertainer. He also keeps the spectators entertained after the matches with his antics and witty comments. He is a different character unlike Roger and Rafa, who are more serious.

When we compare with the days of Mac and Jimbo, these three top players are all very well behaved.

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Post by socal1976 Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 18:40

Leff wrote:On the court, Novak is an entertainer. He also keeps the spectators entertained after the matches with his antics and witty comments. He is a different character unlike Roger and Rafa, who are more serious.

When we compare with the days of Mac and Jimbo, these three top players are all very well behaved.

Now that was bad sportsmanship we could really enjoy. I kind of miss the death of the tennis primmadonna with a bad attitude.

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Post by Tom_____ Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 18:47

Was Mac bad sportmanship tho? surely it was more bratlike behaviour, but i always though Mac help drag the umpiring of the game forwards and away from oldie member doing line calls etc.

Jimbo though i thought utilised gamesmanship and poor sportmanship throughout

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Post by Tenez Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 18:52

Tom_____ wrote:Was Mac bad sportmanship tho? surely it was more bratlike behaviour, but i always though Mac help drag the umpiring of the game forwards and away from oldie member doing line calls etc.

Jimbo though i thought utilised gamesmanship and poor sportmanship throughout

Yep - I agree with that. More importantly Connors benefited immensely from that ugly behaviour on court whereas McEnroe essentially paid the price dearly for his antics.

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Post by Leff Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 19:18

Mac is the most engaging and entertaining commentator.

At the US Open, AmEx supplies us with headphones that provide live commentary. These days, Mac sometimes expresses admiration for Jimmy, saying that son .. . ..... never quit fighting. I suppose we get mellower as we get older. Connor tried commentating occasionally; he was rather mundane.

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Post by FedsFan Mon 12 Sep 2011 - 20:10

Djoko says the right things after the matches and to me he carries it off ok. I mean even when he has lost he has done so with grace. His gesture towards Nadal last year at the USO is an example.

I think his team need to learn to be graceful. That showing in Madrid was disgraceful as is the behaviour of his family and the stuff they come up with. If at all they are the real graceless winners.

Being #1 means having to set a good example and be a role model.

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